Pitt Basketball 2012-13

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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby slappybrown on Fri Mar 22, 2013 12:59 pm

I guess it goes to the larger point about how "good" the job is.

But, and I am guessing entirely, I don't imagine USC exceeds what Pitt draws at the Pete.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby newarenanow on Fri Mar 22, 2013 1:01 pm

KennyTheKangaroo wrote:declining attendance?

Who the eff's fault is it that the attendance is declining?


I don't even think attendance is declining anyway. All the tickets are sold. Only half the people go to the non Big East games, as they did in the past. Poor big East teams bring in about 3/4 and then the good games are full, just like before.

It's not like there is some complete drop off.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby newarenanow on Fri Mar 22, 2013 1:02 pm

Agree Pitt isn't the best job in the NCAA, but it's not like USC is that great either.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby IanMoran on Fri Mar 22, 2013 2:24 pm

I think people are underrating just how hard it is to make final 4's, win championships, etc... There are a lot more teams in college than pro.

Jim Boheim
11 seasons to make final 4 (before then finished - Sweet 16 4 times, 2nd round 4 times, 1st round, and NIT runner up)
15 more seasons until won it all.. .so took 26 years to win it all
Considered a legend for 4 final fours, one championship in 37 seasons

Jim Calhoun
I find it unfair to count his years at Northeastern.. so
13 years at Uconn until first final 4 (3 elite 8's, 2 sweet 16's, second round, 4 NITs, 1 no post season tourny before then)

Tom Crean in 14th season at Indiana / Marquette
- Is he really that much better of a coach because he made 1 final 4 (missed touney 6 times, only 1 other sweet 16)

Jamie Dixon has had a TON of success. I refuse to believe that he'd be considered PREMIER / ONE OF GREATEST COACHES EVAAA if crazy games against Villanova, Butler went differently, but since they didn't he needs to go.

In single elimination, March Madness it often takes some time, but Dixon consistently has them in the right position and I honestly feel greater results will come. I find it much more likely for Pitt to do a Wake Forest without him.

Its easy to overreact after probably the worst loss of his career

There aren't that many better out there... and I think STEVE PEDERSON being the one conducting the next potential coaching search can't be overlooked. I'll put my faith in Dixon over Pederson finding a replacment
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby Rocco on Fri Mar 22, 2013 2:34 pm

http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/blog/?p=225

As of 2011, Boeheim's teams have won about 3 more games than expected. Last year they lost to a #2 seed so the number may be lower (though they got there without their center, who was suspended because he can't read and cheated on a test). Calhoun's teams won almost 5 games more than expected. Dixon's teams lost 4.59 more games than expected. Don't compare them.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby IanMoran on Fri Mar 22, 2013 2:40 pm

Total results of where they've finished in bracket match up favorably for Dixon thus far in his career. You want to punish him for better overall results because of a seeding expectancy statistic? By your argument all those coaches missing tourney completely > losing as an 8 seed to a 9 seed.

Dixon isn't missing a "clutch" gene because of a layup as time expires and crazy foul. Clutch = small sample size
Last edited by IanMoran on Fri Mar 22, 2013 2:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby columbia on Fri Mar 22, 2013 2:42 pm

I'm cool with Dixon being like Barry Trotz.
Bigotry of low expectations, perhaps?
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby KennyTheKangaroo on Fri Mar 22, 2013 2:48 pm

depending on how recruiting goes the next two years,and if adams stays, pitt's next legit chance to go deep in the tournament is 2015.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby Rocco on Fri Mar 22, 2013 2:54 pm

IanMoran wrote:Total results of where they've finished in bracket match up favorably to Dixon thus far in his career. You want to punish him for better overall results because of a seeding expectancy statistic? By your argument all those coaches missing tourney completely > losing as an 8 seed to a 9 seed.

Dixon isn't missing a "clutch" gene because of a layup as time expires and crazy foul. Clutch = small sample size


It was harder to make the tourney before 1985. In Boeheim's first year only 32 teams made the tourney. 68 teams make the tourney now. If you're a team from a power conference you basically have to go .500 in the conference and win 11-12 cupcake games, so getting to the dance isn't the same accomplishment it was in the 60s and 70s. And you would certainly expect a #1 seed to get past the opening weekend, which Pitt failed to do the last time they had a #1 seed.

The players have changed, yet his teams consistently come up small, get pushed around despite claims of being physical, and break down on defense every March. Think back to the 2004 team that was supposedly super-tough but got tossed aside by Oklahoma State, or the 2008 team that was supposedly ready to battle anyone that Michigan State demolished. Those two teams were actually tough instead of simply acting the part. They consistently fail to handle pressure (6 turnovers in the opening 7 minutes yesterday) or make crushing mental mistakes (Nasir Robinson) once the lights get brighter. Yet somehow it's not Dixon's fault. How many times do the same things have to happen before they are no longer isolated instances? Previously the excuse was that Pitt tried too hard to win the Big East tourney because of all the NY based players like Knight, Krauser et al. and wore themselves out. Now they consistently flop in the Big East tourney (1-5 the last 5 years, the one win being over a lousy St. John's team) so that excuse no longer holds water.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby Malkamaniac on Fri Mar 22, 2013 3:39 pm

I'm 100% convinced that he's going to take the style they use now into the ACC and get dismantled by better teams.

I seriously hope he employs a more open style of game for success there.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby ExPatriatePen on Sat Mar 23, 2013 4:18 pm

newarenanow wrote:Pitt finished the regular season #17 in the AP and #19 in the coaches.

Georgetown finished #5 in both.

Not bad for a team that won't sniff the tourney and another team that is absolutely horrendous.


newarenanow wrote:
Rocco wrote:
newarenanow wrote:Pitt #20 in latest AP.

Georgetown #5.

Zags #1 for first time.


But will Pitt sniff the tourney?


Doubtful. Pitt's only good win was against a horrendous Georgetown team.



Rocco wrote:That awful Georgetown team is a #2 seed.


Rocco wrote:
newarenanow wrote:Pitt #20 in latest AP.

Georgetown #5.

Zags #1 for first time.


But will Pitt sniff the tourney?


Congrats to all of those who saw Georgetown and Pitt being so dominant
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby columbia on Sat Mar 23, 2013 4:21 pm

Welcome back, EPP. :)
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby IanMoran on Sat Mar 23, 2013 4:59 pm

Jamie Dixon was right in front of me security in Pgh airport. I should have followed him, found out flight, and start #dixonwatch
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby IanMoran on Sat Mar 23, 2013 5:00 pm

Saw he just signed 5 year extension
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby columbia on Sat Mar 23, 2013 5:01 pm

This should end well.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby IanMoran on Sat Mar 23, 2013 5:03 pm

columbia wrote:This should end well.

I couldn't be more thrilled, but I know I'll be alone
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby Rocco on Sat Mar 23, 2013 5:28 pm

Dixon leveraged Pitt's fear of the unknown into a 10 year contract extension.

http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketb ... ach-at-usc
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby skullman80 on Sat Mar 23, 2013 5:29 pm

I don't know how anyone could be "thrilled". I guess a "meh" could be understandable.

He's done a ton for Pitt Basketball as a coach, but at this point the program is stagnant. Expectations are greater than they were when he took the job, and understandably so. Is Pitt in a better place than before Dixon took over... of course they are, but at some point they have to take the next step, and I don't know if Dixon is the guy to do that at this point.

Next year in the ACC is gonna be interesting. 70ish points a game isn't gonna do it most nights.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby Tomas on Sat Mar 23, 2013 6:47 pm

I'll be thrilled to take "stagnant" every day. That is, if "stagnant" means that despite working in a city with well below-average excitement for the local college teams, the guy makes his team a lock for the NCAA tournament pretty much every year, which implies that during the course of pretty much every season I'll have a significant number of days when I can see my team winning.

(speaks as the guy who lived through some astoundingly bad years of Pitt basketball, and now lives in a top college town that has not seen an NCAA berth in a very, very long time - all that while constantly firing one coach after another so that the team does not become "stagnant".)

Plus, just based on the law of large numbers, if Dixon continues putting the team into the Tournament, the Final 4 will *eventually* come even if the chances of advancing in subsequent rounds are below 50%! :)

[If a team lead by Dixon has 40% chance of advancing into any subsequent round, then the chance of making the Final 4 is 0.4^4 = 2.56%. But, if he gets his team to the tournament 27 times, there is 1- (1-0.0256)^27 = 50.4% chance he will get them into at least one Final 4! :D ]
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby TheHammer24 on Sat Mar 23, 2013 7:23 pm

That's a remarkably good post, Tomas. :thumb:
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby shafnutz05 on Sat Mar 23, 2013 9:16 pm

10 year contract extension.....damn
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby columbia on Sat Mar 23, 2013 9:18 pm

shafnutz05 wrote:10 year contract extension.....damn


You'll be at 150,000 posts and Rocco will still be griping about Dixon.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby King Sid the Great 87 on Sun Mar 24, 2013 9:46 am

Pitt has Stockholm syndrome when it comes to Dixon.

It can be argued the program has gone nowhere in the last decade but Dixon is a great captor because the time before he and Howland showed up were terrible.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby newarenanow on Sun Mar 24, 2013 9:58 am

ExPatriatePen wrote:
newarenanow wrote:Pitt finished the regular season #17 in the AP and #19 in the coaches.

Georgetown finished #5 in both.

Not bad for a team that won't sniff the tourney and another team that is absolutely horrendous.


newarenanow wrote:
Rocco wrote:
newarenanow wrote:Pitt #20 in latest AP.

Georgetown #5.

Zags #1 for first time.


But will Pitt sniff the tourney?


Doubtful. Pitt's only good win was against a horrendous Georgetown team.



Rocco wrote:That awful Georgetown team is a #2 seed.


Rocco wrote:
newarenanow wrote:Pitt #20 in latest AP.

Georgetown #5.

Zags #1 for first time.


But will Pitt sniff the tourney?


Congrats to all of those who saw Georgetown and Pitt being so dominant


Where did it say they were dominant? I was just pointing out they weren't "awful" and "wouldn't sniff the tourney".
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby ulf on Sun Mar 24, 2013 11:27 am

WVU had a good showing in the tournament. Anyway, another first round exit gets a ten year extension? BS. Should have either made him stick to the current contract or walk.
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