Pitt Basketball 2012-13

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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby KennyTheKangaroo on Fri Mar 29, 2013 10:23 am

in a lot of ways, the ucla hoops job is one of the worst in college sports.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby pfim on Fri Mar 29, 2013 10:46 am

KennyTheKangaroo wrote:in a lot of ways, the ucla hoops job is one of the worst in college sports.


College basketball is also a much different animal. You can make money in the lesser conferences and still build a team that is competitive in the tournament. Can't say the same in football for the most part. If you can make $1-2 million at VCU, always make the tournament and give yourself a shot, why go to LA and the ridiculous expectations that come with that job?
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby ExPatriatePen on Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:19 pm

Prestige.

You can be the greatest coach ever at VCU and you'll be forgotten in a decade.

From 1961 to 1963 a Cincinnati was in the final three times and won it twice. Who was their coach?

I don't think I have to ask that question for Indiana in the '80's and 90's, Georgetown in the 80's, Kentucky in 50's, etc...

These HC's have ego's, they want to perform on the biggest stage possible.

But as I said, what do I know?
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby KennyTheKangaroo on Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:21 pm

ExPatriatePen wrote:Prestige.

You can be the greatest coach ever at VCU and you'll be forgotten in a decade.



You can be a great coach at UCLA and lose your job over not being great enough.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby ExPatriatePen on Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:25 pm

KennyTheKangaroo wrote:
ExPatriatePen wrote:Prestige.

You can be the greatest coach ever at VCU and you'll be forgotten in a decade.



You can be a great coach at UCLA and lose your job over not being great enough.


Great coaches don't fret over that stuff, they embrace it.

The guys who worry about that aren't the Adolph Rupps, the John Thompsons, the Bobby Knights or the John Woodens.

JMHO
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby pfim on Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:42 pm

ExPatriatePen wrote:
KennyTheKangaroo wrote:
ExPatriatePen wrote:Prestige.

You can be the greatest coach ever at VCU and you'll be forgotten in a decade.



You can be a great coach at UCLA and lose your job over not being great enough.


Great coaches don't fret over that stuff, they embrace it.

The guys who worry about that aren't the Adolph Rupps, the John Thompsons, the Bobby Knights or the John Woodens.

JMHO


Again, you're talking about a different era though, when VCUs and Butlers didn't make it to final fours, and didn't pay their coaches millions of dollars, didn't play on national television. I don't think Shaka Smart or Brad Stevens are lacking in prestige, actually quite the opposite.

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaab-the-dagger/warning-schools-interested-gregg-marshall-won-t-easy-145403691--ncaab.html;_ylt=AuWyK51._jS_.Y86lWLCuas7Ysp_;_ylu=X3oDMTE4NWRia245BG1pdANCbG9ncyBJbmRleARwb3MDMQRzZWMDTWVkaWFCbG9nSW5kZXg-;_ylg=X3oDMTFpMm9iMzh1BGludGwDdXMEbGFuZwNlbi11cwRwc3RhaWQDBHBzdGNhdANibG9nBHB0A3NlY3Rpb25z;_ylv=3
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby pfim on Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:56 pm

At any rate, it appears both Smart and Stevens are staying put, and they were by most accounts two of UCLA's top targets.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby ExPatriatePen on Fri Mar 29, 2013 1:29 pm

Probably the best argument against my position is what you just said. By the same token, Creen left Marquette for Indy (and a host of other examples exist as well) so it cuts both ways.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby Rylan on Fri Mar 29, 2013 2:26 pm

Stevens and Smart have built programs out of the rubble. In my opinion, that is more prestigious than taking over a UCLA school that was a tournament team, had one of the best recruiting classes last year, and in the past decade was a Final Four team twice.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby Rocco on Fri Mar 29, 2013 5:56 pm

Rylan wrote:Stevens and Smart have built programs out of the rubble. In my opinion, that is more prestigious than taking over a UCLA school that was a tournament team, had one of the best recruiting classes last year, and in the past decade was a Final Four team twice.


Smart took over for Anthony Grant when Grant went to Bama, who took over for Jeff Capel when Capel went to Oklahoma. Both Capel and Grant succeeded there- Capel made it to the tourney twice, and Grant got them there all 3 years he was there. He had a strong program to begin with. Let's not get carried away.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby Tomas on Tue Apr 02, 2013 1:26 am

I am not against locking Dixon, but I do find it funny that the university that Pitt perceived to be such a credible threat ended up hiring a coach with just 2 years of head coaching experience, both in a very low-level conference where only 2 teams ended with above 0.500 record - and his team did not even win that conference's regular season.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby Rylan on Tue Apr 02, 2013 1:43 am

Rocco wrote:
Rylan wrote:Stevens and Smart have built programs out of the rubble. In my opinion, that is more prestigious than taking over a UCLA school that was a tournament team, had one of the best recruiting classes last year, and in the past decade was a Final Four team twice.


Smart took over for Anthony Grant when Grant went to Bama, who took over for Jeff Capel when Capel went to Oklahoma. Both Capel and Grant succeeded there- Capel made it to the tourney twice, and Grant got them there all 3 years he was there. He had a strong program to begin with. Let's not get carried away.


Ok I didn't really follow VCU before their recent big success. So I am wrong about that, but what about Stevens?
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby Rocco on Tue Apr 02, 2013 8:40 am

Rylan wrote:
Rocco wrote:
Rylan wrote:Stevens and Smart have built programs out of the rubble. In my opinion, that is more prestigious than taking over a UCLA school that was a tournament team, had one of the best recruiting classes last year, and in the past decade was a Final Four team twice.


Smart took over for Anthony Grant when Grant went to Bama, who took over for Jeff Capel when Capel went to Oklahoma. Both Capel and Grant succeeded there- Capel made it to the tourney twice, and Grant got them there all 3 years he was there. He had a strong program to begin with. Let's not get carried away.


Ok I didn't really follow VCU before their recent big success. So I am wrong about that, but what about Stevens?


http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/butler/

You're 0 for 2. They also benefited from Indiana being on sanctions and in a crater for a while last decade.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby Rocco on Tue Apr 02, 2013 8:29 pm

Steven Adams and Trey Zeigler- gone. Adams to the NBA, Zeigler another school.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby skullman80 on Tue Apr 02, 2013 8:47 pm

Is Adams NBA ready? Sure didn't seem like it.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby viva la ben on Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:44 pm

Chris Taft was more NBA ready than this guy.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby Rocco on Tue Apr 02, 2013 11:29 pm

skullman80 wrote:Is Adams NBA ready? Sure didn't seem like it.


Defensively? Somewhat. Offensively? Not even close.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby pfim on Wed Apr 03, 2013 9:43 am

skullman80 wrote:Is Adams NBA ready? Sure didn't seem like it.


The NBA doesn't draft NBA ready players. People talk about this all the time like it's a factor in NBA evaluation, then watch 7', 205 lb international players get picked over their favorite productive college player. It just doesn't matter, it's not a factor at all.

It's a big loss for the program, no doubt, but the decision seems to be 100% about money and his family. Still, it's completely illogical for him to not go through the draft advisory process.

Trey Zeigler is a fairly terrible division 1 basketball player and is no loss, though they will need bodies for next year.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby KennyTheKangaroo on Wed Apr 03, 2013 9:52 am

the nba no doubt drafts guys that are not nba ready

but the recent trend is to send guys that are projects to the nba d-league to work on their game

so if adams wants to get drafted in the second round, and ride a bus to cities like sioux falls and frisco texas instead of playing at cameron indoor and the dean dome, so be it.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby pfim on Wed Apr 03, 2013 9:57 am

I think it's fairly likely that he'll go in the first, get his guaranteed money, and then play in the D league. Though draft position is not guaranteed and as I said above, not going through the draft advisory process at this point is just plain dumb.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby slappybrown on Wed Apr 03, 2013 10:10 am

All the mocks I have seen have him going in the 15-22 range or so. Its a no brainer.

Remember that time that dude's tibia shot through the skin of his leg while he was playing for free? That's why you take guaranteed money.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby slappybrown on Wed Apr 03, 2013 10:10 am

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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby pfim on Wed Apr 03, 2013 10:25 am

slappybrown wrote:All the mocks I have seen have him going in the 15-22 range or so. Its a no brainer.

Remember that time that dude's tibia shot through the skin of his leg while he was playing for free? That's why you take guaranteed money.


Chris Taft was a top 5 pick at this time in most mock drafts the year he left. The mocks aren't the same as going through the advisory process and getting feedback from NBA GMs.

And again, there is absolutely nothing to lose by going through the process. Even if you're 100% sure you're going.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby slappybrown on Wed Apr 03, 2013 10:28 am

I don't disagree with you. But I don't think he did this without receiving some degree of insight from people in the know. Going through the formal process costs him nothing, so I agree.
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Re: Pitt Basketball 2012-13

Postby KennyTheKangaroo on Wed Apr 03, 2013 10:30 am

D. Blair was a 1st round pick in mock drafts too.
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