The Program

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The Program

Postby topshelf66 on Mon Jun 10, 2013 12:47 pm

There will be a lot of agonizing once it is learned the we are keep HCDB at least though his current contract.

In 2008 we got to a cup final at least a year ahead of schedule, in 2009 we cashed that in. A critisism of our organiztion at the time was that we had "tanked" a few seasons in order to stockpile high draft picks. This was a Florida Marlins type of model. Make a run, fire sale, stockplie picks, make another run a few years later.

I believe that the current management wants to build a sustainable program like they have built in Detroit. This was their 22nd consecutive year in the playoffs. During the 22 years, they have not been eliminated in the first round in any two consecutive years. You may not like them, but that is domn impressive.

Once you are getting to the playoffs consistenly, there is going to be disappointment much more often than parades. Detroit won 4 cups in those 22 years which is the gold standard for success in the post Edmonton era. This means there were 18 years of fan lament at the end of the season.

I am not giving the coaches and players a pass for what has happened over the past two seasons. We have to believe that we can get better moving forward. The Boston series was a disaster. The 95-96 Detroit team has 131 points and lost to an expansion team in the first round. You can't burn down the village.

I also believe that managment believes continuity at Head Coach and GM are key elements to sustaining this type of excellence. They have people who they believe in at both positions and they will be given a much longer leash than many believe that they deserve.

Management has lived up to its end of the bargain and they deserve some respect from the fanbase. They have invested in people, facilities, fan relations and the community at large. As a sponsor who works with many individuals employed by the Penguins, I can say that they quality of people they have is top notch in all areas.

1. The deadline deals were fantasy hockey. Murray helped with some physicality. Morrow helped some with grit. Iginila was a failure 5 on 5. Jokenin was an insurance policy for Sid.
2. Get to our game has to go. We are not the Alcindor led UCLA Bruins. Someone will figure out how to beat you. More evidence of that than we care to admit.
3. Fleury has not developed at all. Work on puck handling, composure when the puck is behind your net. He has been content to go on talent alone. Shame on the team for letting him.
4. Letang has progressed in his play but has never been held accountable for mental errors. You can almost feel that he is chasing statistics to be in the conversations with Green and Erikson etc....

My guesses....

Staying: Coach, 29, 71, 58, 36.
Leaving: Meloche, 9, 24, 48, 12, 10, 3.

Advancing: 47, 19, 41.
Regressing: 44, 5, 2.

New: Harrington, wing for 71, wings for 16.
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Re: The Program

Postby Great58 on Mon Jun 10, 2013 5:35 pm

I'd hate to lose 9 and 24. Cooke was our most consistent player throughout the playoffs, and Dupuis has played an invaluable part since his acquisition. I get that they might not fit into the salary structure since they will both be looking for the last significant contracts of their careers, but I think GMRS should try his best to make it happen.

I'd Staal Letang and trade him now so as to get a return on the investment, he won't fit into the salary cap.

I'm indifferent regarding HCDB. I was a staunch supporter up until now, but 2 goals in 4 games with this talent does suggest he isn't making the adjustments necessary to win when it's hard to do so. I guess I will wait and see if the Bruins do the same thing to the Hawks. If they do, I guess it will make the Pens loss seem less our own faults and more a credit to the Bruins.
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Re: The Program

Postby Daniel87 on Mon Jun 10, 2013 5:50 pm

You think Bylsma, Fleury, Jokinen, and Letang all have a better chance of staying than Dupuis? Huh?

If 'get to our game' has to go then Bylsma has to go. They are one in the same.
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Re: The Program

Postby topshelf66 on Wed Jun 12, 2013 11:19 am

Let the agonizing begin.

I wanted him gone for about 48 hours. Now I agree with the program approach.
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Re: The Program

Postby npv708 on Wed Jun 12, 2013 11:36 am

I'm guessing you fail to realize that there has been 4 different coaches in Detroit during that 22 year period?
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Re: The Program

Postby topshelf66 on Wed Jun 12, 2013 11:49 am

I do realize.
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Re: The Program

Postby topshelf66 on Wed Jun 12, 2013 12:03 pm

There is still a lot of continuity. Bowman retired and now you have Babcock, who is a great coach with 1 cup win.

GMRS seemed to echo some of my original post in his comments today.
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Re: The Program

Postby npv708 on Wed Jun 12, 2013 12:05 pm

topshelf66 wrote:There is still a lot of continuity. Bowman retired and now you have Babcock, who is a great coach with 1 cup win.

GMRS seemed to echo some of my original post in his comments today.


Started with Murray...who was fired after 3 seasons.

After Scoty retired, they hired Dave Lewis, who was fired after 3 seasons. Then they hired Babcock in 2005.
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Re: The Program

Postby headh on Wed Jun 12, 2013 1:41 pm

topshelf66 wrote:There will be a lot of agonizing once it is learned the we are keep HCDB at least though his current contract.

In 2008 we got to a cup final at least a year ahead of schedule, in 2009 we cashed that in. A critisism of our organiztion at the time was that we had "tanked" a few seasons in order to stockpile high draft picks. This was a Florida Marlins type of model. Make a run, fire sale, stockplie picks, make another run a few years later.

I believe that the current management wants to build a sustainable program like they have built in Detroit. This was their 22nd consecutive year in the playoffs. During the 22 years, they have not been eliminated in the first round in any two consecutive years. You may not like them, but that is domn impressive.

Once you are getting to the playoffs consistenly, there is going to be disappointment much more often than parades. Detroit won 4 cups in those 22 years which is the gold standard for success in the post Edmonton era. This means there were 18 years of fan lament at the end of the season.

I am not giving the coaches and players a pass for what has happened over the past two seasons. We have to believe that we can get better moving forward. The Boston series was a disaster. The 95-96 Detroit team has 131 points and lost to an expansion team in the first round. You can't burn down the village.

I also believe that managment believes continuity at Head Coach and GM are key elements to sustaining this type of excellence. They have people who they believe in at both positions and they will be given a much longer leash than many believe that they deserve.

Management has lived up to its end of the bargain and they deserve some respect from the fanbase. They have invested in people, facilities, fan relations and the community at large. As a sponsor who works with many individuals employed by the Penguins, I can say that they quality of people they have is top notch in all areas.

1. The deadline deals were fantasy hockey. Murray helped with some physicality. Morrow helped some with grit. Iginila was a failure 5 on 5. Jokenin was an insurance policy for Sid.
2. Get to our game has to go. We are not the Alcindor led UCLA Bruins. Someone will figure out how to beat you. More evidence of that than we care to admit.
3. Fleury has not developed at all. Work on puck handling, composure when the puck is behind your net. He has been content to go on talent alone. Shame on the team for letting him.
4. Letang has progressed in his play but has never been held accountable for mental errors. You can almost feel that he is chasing statistics to be in the conversations with Green and Erikson etc....

My guesses....

Staying: Coach, 29, 71, 58, 36.
Leaving: Meloche, 9, 24, 48, 12, 10, 3.

Advancing: 47, 19, 41.
Regressing: 44, 5, 2.

New: Harrington, wing for 71, wings for 16.



This has to be it. Detroit is the best franchise in the NHL. Give credit to #66 for wanting to emulate the very best
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Re: The Program

Postby wondermoose on Wed Jun 12, 2013 1:54 pm

Sorry, but there is no way Fleury stays. Shero and Bylsma can say it all they want right now, but come the draft he will be gone by buyout or trade. Don't forget Hartzell wants to play here and, make no mistake, he is an NHL goalie in the making.

Also, I think Dupuis stays because he wants to and maybe Cooke too. If they want to model Detroit, then they know you have a few role players that you simply never allow to leave (Draper, Maltby, Holmstrom, etc). Cooke is a maybe because he can't be as effective as before the suspensions. He was our Lapierre, our Marchand, our Rinaldo, but those days are gone. We really, really, really need that type of energy player that just annoys the piss out of everyone on the other team. Cooke just can't do that anymore. That said, he's very valuable in the PK and third/fourth line role anyways. I'd rather replace TK or Adams with that type of player before Cooke.

Also, I'll start the "Bring Back Scuderi" train here. He's like the Dark Knight; we need him to come back and save Gotham.
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Re: The Program

Postby headh on Wed Jun 12, 2013 3:19 pm

wondermoose wrote:Sorry, but there is no way Fleury stays. Shero and Bylsma can say it all they want right now, but come the draft he will be gone by buyout or trade. Don't forget Hartzell wants to play here and, make no mistake, he is an NHL goalie in the making.

Also, I think Dupuis stays because he wants to and maybe Cooke too. If they want to model Detroit, then they know you have a few role players that you simply never allow to leave (Draper, Maltby, Holmstrom, etc). Cooke is a maybe because he can't be as effective as before the suspensions. He was our Lapierre, our Marchand, our Rinaldo, but those days are gone. We really, really, really need that type of energy player that just annoys the piss out of everyone on the other team. Cooke just can't do that anymore. That said, he's very valuable in the PK and third/fourth line role anyways. I'd rather replace TK or Adams with that type of player before Cooke.

Also, I'll start the "Bring Back Scuderi" train here. He's like the Dark Knight; we need him to come back and save Gotham.



ON BOARD. Trade Letang and use his 3.5 mil for Scuds
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Re: The Program

Postby topshelf66 on Wed Jun 12, 2013 5:50 pm

I consider only firing 2 coaches over 22 years continuity.

There are other considerations of course. Buffalo had a lot of continuity without much to show in the playoffs. They did get a new facility however and most of the Reiger/Ruff era was at a cap-free spending disadvantage.

I think that as disappointing as the last two seasons have been, they believe in their coach.

A lot of us hypothesize about what went wrong the past two seasons. I have to trust that Mario has a better idea than we do. If he believes in this direction, then I do as well.
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Re: The Program

Postby wondermoose on Wed Jun 12, 2013 6:29 pm

topshelf66 wrote:I consider only firing 2 coaches over 22 years continuity.

There are other considerations of course. Buffalo had a lot of continuity without much to show in the playoffs. They did get a new facility however and most of the Reiger/Ruff era was at a cap-free spending disadvantage.

I think that as disappointing as the last two seasons have been, they believe in their coach.

A lot of us hypothesize about what went wrong the past two seasons. I have to trust that Mario has a better idea than we do. If he believes in this direction, then I do as well.


I don't really think Mario has a better idea of how to run a team so I take whatever Shero does as what he wants to do. After all, Mario is the man that chased Scotty Bowman off and welcomed the country-club mentality with open arms, not to mention his opposition to several trades in early 90s that are often credited as the missing pieces of the Cups.
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Re: The Program

Postby topshelf66 on Wed Jun 12, 2013 6:37 pm

Indeed Mario lived through what you pointed out. I would think that this gives him a pretty good perspective on what is going on now. He has the experience to watch the Boston series and determine if the coach was negligent enough to be fired.
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