Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Forum for Pittsburgh Penguins-related messages.

Moderators: Three Stars, dagny, pfim, netwolf

Re: Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Postby columbia on Thu Jun 13, 2013 1:19 pm

For those looking for a defenseman in return in a (potential) Letang trade....your realistic suggestions?

(Keep in mind that I don't have much interest in trading him for a high pick; the easiest/most realistic return would probably center around a young F.)
columbia
NHL Third Liner
NHL Third Liner
 
Posts: 46,260
Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2008 12:13 am

Re: Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Postby longtimefan on Thu Jun 13, 2013 1:20 pm

The entry level contracts aren't what they are being made out to be. They aren't cheap. Nail Yakupov was number one last season. Performed well, but wasn't a star immediately. His cap hit is #3.775 M for the first three years. Then he's an RFA. If he pans out big, he's looking at $6 or $7 million on his next deal. It doesn't seem practical to let a kid learn on the job at that kind of cap hit. Not when the cap is the problem.

http://www.capgeek.com/oilers/
longtimefan
ECHL'er
ECHL'er
 
Posts: 869
Joined: Mon Jan 29, 2007 7:33 pm

Re: Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Postby AlexPKeaton on Thu Jun 13, 2013 1:22 pm

murphydump55 wrote:
Yes he will lack experience. But he is a bigger version of Letang, and is American so less prone to stupidity, and much cheaper than Letang for a long time.


Just curious why being American makes him less prone to stupidity? LOL

This should be interesting, please enlighten.


Because in Canada, the plebians play hockey, just like in the US the plebians play football. Therefore there is a much higher percentage of pleb canadian hockey players than american.
AlexPKeaton
NHL Healthy Scratch
NHL Healthy Scratch
 
Posts: 12,707
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2007 9:46 am
Location: Malkinite Compound

Re: Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Postby Mr. Colby on Thu Jun 13, 2013 1:24 pm

columbia wrote:For those looking for a defenseman in return in a (potential) Letang trade....your realistic suggestions?

(Keep in mind that I don't have much interest in trading him for a high pick; the easiest/most realistic return would probably center around a young F.)


Jonas Brodin
Mr. Colby
AHL Hall of Famer
AHL Hall of Famer
 
Posts: 8,550
Joined: Sun Dec 09, 2007 1:33 pm
Location: Born and Raised in Kent Manderville

Re: Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Postby mikey287 on Thu Jun 13, 2013 1:25 pm

longtimefan wrote:The entry level contracts aren't what they are being made out to be. They aren't cheap. Nail Yakupov was number one last season. Performed well, but wasn't a star immediately. His cap hit is #3.775 M for the first three years. Then he's an RFA. If he pans out big, he's looking at $6 or $7 million on his next deal. It doesn't seem practical to let a kid learn on the job at that kind of cap hit. Not when the cap is the problem.

http://www.capgeek.com/oilers/


Entry-Level System Cap.

Salary cap on entry-level deals is $925,000 through 2022. Bonuses elevate cap hit but they include many things that may be virtually un-winnable (Hart, Conn Smythe, etc.). Bonuses count towards the Upper Limit until they are mathematically impossible to capture (see: Flyers sending down Brayden Schenn for the first game of the year a couple years ago because of an "82 games played bonus"). Teams allowed to exceed Upper Limit by 7.5% if it is bonuses that will put them "over".

Qualifying offer for next deal would only be 105% of $925,000 (max) or $971,250 to retain rights. Qualifying offer would not be 100% of $3,775,000 to retain exclusive rights.

In short, very effective means of cheap labor for contending teams.
Last edited by mikey287 on Thu Jun 13, 2013 1:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
mikey287
NHL Fourth Liner
NHL Fourth Liner
 
Posts: 17,214
Joined: Sun Jan 29, 2006 6:40 pm
Location: Philadelphia, PA - @MichaelFarkasHF

Re: Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Postby Gaucho on Thu Jun 13, 2013 1:26 pm

AlexPKeaton wrote:
murphydump55 wrote:
Yes he will lack experience. But he is a bigger version of Letang, and is American so less prone to stupidity, and much cheaper than Letang for a long time.


Just curious why being American makes him less prone to stupidity? LOL

This should be interesting, please enlighten.


Because in Canada, the plebians play hockey, just like in the US the plebians play football. Therefore there is a much higher percentage of pleb canadian hockey players than american.


I assume you mean plebeians.
Gaucho
NHL Third Liner
NHL Third Liner
 
Posts: 40,915
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2006 10:22 am
Location: The Onyx Club

Re: Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Postby columbia on Thu Jun 13, 2013 1:28 pm

Image
columbia
NHL Third Liner
NHL Third Liner
 
Posts: 46,260
Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2008 12:13 am

Re: Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Postby Stick_licker on Thu Jun 13, 2013 1:29 pm

Agreed with mikey287. Letang is a bit wild, but you can't over estimate his impact on the team. You're much better off with a talented player who makes bad decisions than with an average player who makes good decisions. The former can be taught to make better decisions and become a league-best player. The latter, while nice to have, can rarely be taught to become more physically gifted. Letang has a higher ceiling than almost any defenseman in the league. You don't trade that away unless he forces you to.
Stick_licker
Junior 'A'
Junior 'A'
 
Posts: 110
Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2011 10:34 am

Re: Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Postby mikey287 on Thu Jun 13, 2013 1:29 pm

Bruins hat...?

He's one of them!
mikey287
NHL Fourth Liner
NHL Fourth Liner
 
Posts: 17,214
Joined: Sun Jan 29, 2006 6:40 pm
Location: Philadelphia, PA - @MichaelFarkasHF

Re: Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Postby thehockeyguru on Thu Jun 13, 2013 1:31 pm

mikey287 wrote:
thehockeyguru wrote:
owtahear wrote:
DontToewsMeBro wrote:16.75M on Perry and Geztlaf.

18.2M on Crosby and Malkin.

I'd say we got pretty good value there, wouldn't you?


Thank you. This puts it in much better perspective.


I'll take Datsyuk and Zetterberg @ 12.7M with the Wings system.


Go be a Wings fan then...weren't you one of the people that said (s)he didn't want to be a Pens fan anymore...? Get goin...

Maybe your new team will sign "defensive ace" Mike Ribeiro for you...


Ribero wouldn't be a good fit on the Wings. You wouldn't see a guy like Lindstrom asking for 9.5M a year even though he deserved it. For a majority of his career he made 7M and only in his last year did he get 7.9M. I think Geno making 9.5M is really going to handicap the Pens, and as a betting man I'd wager that the Wings win a cup before the Pens do.
thehockeyguru
NHL Healthy Scratch
NHL Healthy Scratch
 
Posts: 11,214
Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2008 3:43 pm
Location: I'm 30 minutes away, I'll be there in 10.

Re: Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Postby AlexPKeaton on Thu Jun 13, 2013 1:34 pm

Gaucho wrote:
AlexPKeaton wrote:
murphydump55 wrote:
Yes he will lack experience. But he is a bigger version of Letang, and is American so less prone to stupidity, and much cheaper than Letang for a long time.


Just curious why being American makes him less prone to stupidity? LOL

This should be interesting, please enlighten.


Because in Canada, the plebians play hockey, just like in the US the plebians play football. Therefore there is a much higher percentage of pleb canadian hockey players than american.


I assume you mean plebeians.


I spell it the murican way.
AlexPKeaton
NHL Healthy Scratch
NHL Healthy Scratch
 
Posts: 12,707
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2007 9:46 am
Location: Malkinite Compound

Re: Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Postby Grunthy on Thu Jun 13, 2013 1:41 pm

lidstrom salary used about 13% of his teams cap. if the 2014-2015 season cap is around 68 to 70 million, malkins cap hit would be about 13% of our cap hit. so... lidstrom would have a 9.5 million cap hit based on percentages.
Grunthy
AHL'er
AHL'er
 
Posts: 4,777
Joined: Sat Dec 01, 2007 9:08 pm

Re: Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Postby mikey287 on Thu Jun 13, 2013 1:42 pm

thehockeyguru wrote:
mikey287 wrote:
thehockeyguru wrote:
owtahear wrote:
DontToewsMeBro wrote:16.75M on Perry and Geztlaf.

18.2M on Crosby and Malkin.

I'd say we got pretty good value there, wouldn't you?


Thank you. This puts it in much better perspective.


I'll take Datsyuk and Zetterberg @ 12.7M with the Wings system.


Go be a Wings fan then...weren't you one of the people that said (s)he didn't want to be a Pens fan anymore...? Get goin...

Maybe your new team will sign "defensive ace" Mike Ribeiro for you...


Ribero wouldn't be a good fit on the Wings. You wouldn't see a guy like Lindstrom asking for 9.5M a year even though he deserved it. For a majority of his career he made 7M and only in his last year did he get 7.9M. I think Geno making 9.5M is really going to handicap the Pens, and as a betting man I'd wager that the Wings win a cup before the Pens do.


If you're going to be a Red Wings fan, you might as well spell one of the franchise's best ever players correctly.
mikey287
NHL Fourth Liner
NHL Fourth Liner
 
Posts: 17,214
Joined: Sun Jan 29, 2006 6:40 pm
Location: Philadelphia, PA - @MichaelFarkasHF

Re: Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Postby longtimefan on Thu Jun 13, 2013 1:43 pm

mikey287 wrote:
longtimefan wrote:The entry level contracts aren't what they are being made out to be. They aren't cheap. Nail Yakupov was number one last season. Performed well, but wasn't a star immediately. His cap hit is #3.775 M for the first three years. Then he's an RFA. If he pans out big, he's looking at $6 or $7 million on his next deal. It doesn't seem practical to let a kid learn on the job at that kind of cap hit. Not when the cap is the problem.

http://www.capgeek.com/oilers/


Entry-Level System Cap.

Salary cap on entry-level deals is $925,000 through 2022. Bonuses elevate cap hit but they include many things that may be virtually un-winnable (Hart, Conn Smythe, etc.). Bonuses count towards the Upper Limit until they are mathematically impossible to capture (see: Flyers sending down Brayden Schenn for the first game of the year a couple years ago because of an "82 games played bonus"). Teams allowed to exceed Upper Limit by 7.5% if it is bonuses that will put them "over".

Qualifying offer for next deal would only be 105% of $925,000 (max) or $971,250 to retain rights. Qualifying offer would not be 100% of $3,775,000 to retain exclusive rights.

In short, very effective means of cheap labor for contending teams.


Ok. Cheaper certainly for the 3 years. That makes sense. I understand the point of the qualifying offer, but the players who perform will never sign for that. Sure, if they haven't broken out they will. Isn't this at the same stage you see large deals handed out to the likes of Doughty, Hall, Eberle, Lucic, etc? Cheap labor for the first three years, but could be back in a tough position in three years. In fact, you hope to be in that position, as it would mean that the player will have broken out.
longtimefan
ECHL'er
ECHL'er
 
Posts: 869
Joined: Mon Jan 29, 2007 7:33 pm

Re: Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Postby ExPatriatePen on Thu Jun 13, 2013 1:43 pm

mikey287 wrote:Bruins hat...?

He's one of them!

Explains a lot doesn't it? ;) ;) :pop:
ExPatriatePen
NHL Fourth Liner
NHL Fourth Liner
 
Posts: 22,691
Joined: Sat Feb 04, 2006 3:57 pm
Location: Source, Destination, Protocol, Port, size, sequence number, check sum... Yep, that about covers it.

Re: Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Postby thehockeyguru on Thu Jun 13, 2013 1:49 pm

mikey287 wrote:If you're going to be a Red Wings fan, you might as well spell one of the franchise's best ever players correctly.


Was using my phone, it must have auto-corrected. Regardless of what team I root for, I'm also a fan of hockey. There are certain teams in every sport that have a system/structure in place that make them competitive year in and year out. The Red Wings are one of those teams and that has to be respected. People can say that this is a great day for Penguins hockey, but to me with HCDB still coaching, this team lacks structure and in turn still doesnt have an identity.
thehockeyguru
NHL Healthy Scratch
NHL Healthy Scratch
 
Posts: 11,214
Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2008 3:43 pm
Location: I'm 30 minutes away, I'll be there in 10.

Re: Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Postby Crankshaft on Thu Jun 13, 2013 1:51 pm

This team has an identity. It's solidified for the next 8 years.

Image
Crankshaft
AHL All-Star
AHL All-Star
 
Posts: 6,022
Joined: Tue May 07, 2013 12:35 pm

Re: Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Postby mikey287 on Thu Jun 13, 2013 1:53 pm

longtimefan wrote:
mikey287 wrote:
longtimefan wrote:The entry level contracts aren't what they are being made out to be. They aren't cheap. Nail Yakupov was number one last season. Performed well, but wasn't a star immediately. His cap hit is #3.775 M for the first three years. Then he's an RFA. If he pans out big, he's looking at $6 or $7 million on his next deal. It doesn't seem practical to let a kid learn on the job at that kind of cap hit. Not when the cap is the problem.

http://www.capgeek.com/oilers/


Entry-Level System Cap.

Salary cap on entry-level deals is $925,000 through 2022. Bonuses elevate cap hit but they include many things that may be virtually un-winnable (Hart, Conn Smythe, etc.). Bonuses count towards the Upper Limit until they are mathematically impossible to capture (see: Flyers sending down Brayden Schenn for the first game of the year a couple years ago because of an "82 games played bonus"). Teams allowed to exceed Upper Limit by 7.5% if it is bonuses that will put them "over".

Qualifying offer for next deal would only be 105% of $925,000 (max) or $971,250 to retain rights. Qualifying offer would not be 100% of $3,775,000 to retain exclusive rights.

In short, very effective means of cheap labor for contending teams.


Ok. Cheaper certainly for the 3 years. That makes sense. I understand the point of the qualifying offer, but the players who perform will never sign for that. Sure, if they haven't broken out they will. Isn't this at the same stage you see large deals handed out to the likes of Doughty, Hall, Eberle, Lucic, etc? Cheap labor for the first three years, but could be back in a tough position in three years. In fact, you hope to be in that position, as it would mean that the player will have broken out.


"Second contract" also returning (see: P.K. Subban).

Good players won't sign for cheap, no, certainly not. I'm not sure what the next question/qualm is, respectfully. Load up on veteran talent, fill in holes with young, cheap players. When young, cheap players start becoming older, more expensive players the veteran talent has moved on or retired. Natural ebb and flow of a consistent contender. Starts with a foundation in good scouting/drafting.
mikey287
NHL Fourth Liner
NHL Fourth Liner
 
Posts: 17,214
Joined: Sun Jan 29, 2006 6:40 pm
Location: Philadelphia, PA - @MichaelFarkasHF

Re: Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Postby thehockeyguru on Thu Jun 13, 2013 1:56 pm

Crankshaft wrote:This team has an identity. It's solidified for the next 8 years.

Image


A lot of that teams success was still rooted in the ideology of Therrien. Since HCDB has taken control and implemented his system there has been limited success.
thehockeyguru
NHL Healthy Scratch
NHL Healthy Scratch
 
Posts: 11,214
Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2008 3:43 pm
Location: I'm 30 minutes away, I'll be there in 10.

Re: Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Postby BigMcK on Thu Jun 13, 2013 2:09 pm

mikey287 wrote:Good players won't sign for cheap, no, certainly not. I'm not sure what the next question/qualm is, respectfully. Load up on veteran talent, fill in holes with young, cheap players. When young, cheap players start becoming older, more expensive players the veteran talent has moved on or retired. Natural ebb and flow of a consistent contender. Starts with a foundation in good scouting/drafting.


Doesn't that model assume that you start with quality young, cheap players that mature enough to become veteran talent? Or are you saying acquire veteran talent and add to that? The one variable, of course, is lousy coaching that doesn't allow the young players to play and earn experience, or force them to play a position that is foreign to them. Development is a key ingredient -- as I know you know.


By the way, off subject from Malkin. Are you aware of any good books or articles written by past / current referees (I know, easy joke to be made that referees can't see, let alone spell) that sheds light on the banter that goes on between them and players, or players vs players? Having played enough beer league hockey, I know the insults and cursing, so what I am thinking is more along the stories that are told.
BigMcK
ECHL'er
ECHL'er
 
Posts: 2,049
Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2010 4:23 pm
Location: Are you there, yet?

Re: Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Postby newarenanow on Thu Jun 13, 2013 2:16 pm

Great news. Not surprising though.
newarenanow
NHL Third Liner
NHL Third Liner
 
Posts: 41,307
Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2006 1:56 pm

Re: Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Postby Crankshaft on Thu Jun 13, 2013 3:02 pm

murphydump55 wrote:
Yes he will lack experience. But he is a bigger version of Letang, and is American so less prone to stupidity, and much cheaper than Letang for a long time.


Just curious why being American makes him less prone to stupidity? LOL

This should be interesting, please enlighten.


Sounds ridiculous, right? Kinda like when a Canadian just points out the fact that they're Canadian to prove they're more knowledgeable about hockey.
Crankshaft
AHL All-Star
AHL All-Star
 
Posts: 6,022
Joined: Tue May 07, 2013 12:35 pm

Re: Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Postby Scott on Thu Jun 13, 2013 3:25 pm

The ease and speed of this getting done I am certain had more to do with Bylsma getting extended.

I am glad he is signed. Now that he is signed the firings can go on as planned. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Scott
ECHL'er
ECHL'er
 
Posts: 1,920
Joined: Sun Jan 29, 2006 10:11 am
Location: The Quick Stop roof playing hockey

Re: Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Postby Idoit40fans on Thu Jun 13, 2013 3:32 pm

It getting done quickly leads me to believe what I believed all along. Malkin knew he was staying in Pittsburgh all along. He probably knew what he was worth all along too and knew he could make this go very quickly. I'm score.
Idoit40fans
NHL Third Liner
NHL Third Liner
 
Posts: 52,165
Joined: Sat Dec 09, 2006 2:42 pm
Location: No Reading, No Research, Just Strong Opinions

Re: Malkin signs 8 yr/76m Contract Extension

Postby SubtropicalPenguin on Thu Jun 13, 2013 3:49 pm

Is the deal 9.5 each year, or is there any variation by year? I know the new CBA limits back diving deals, but not completely.

If it is 9.5 per year, I wonder why they didnt try to do something a bit front-loaded to keep the cap hit down. My understanding of the new CBA is you can have no more than 35% variation year by year, and the lowest year can be no less than 50% of the highest year. I wonder if the Malkin camp would have accepted something like this: 12 - 12 - 12 - 9.0 - 8.0 - 6.0 - 6.0 - 6.0.

That comes out to 8 years, 71 million, cap hit of 8.875 per year. The time value of 12 million over 9.5 million for the first 3 years, if invested relatively conservatively at just under 8% would give an extra 2 million for the first year salary bump, around 1.7 million for the second year salary bump and around 1.3 million for the third year salary bump over the term of the contract. These are rough estimates with yearly compounding interest rather than continuous or monthly compounding interest. It would probably require some tweaking to get the figures everone would be ok with, but a few hundred thousand saved against the cap could be helpful down the road. This set up would net the functional equivalent of almost exactly 76 million over 8 years once you factor in the time value of the increased salary for years 1 through 3 and it saves 625k against the cap hit.

Either way, I'm happy to have the big man in the Burgh for the foreseeable future.
SubtropicalPenguin
Junior 'A'
Junior 'A'
 
Posts: 101
Joined: Tue Apr 30, 2013 9:52 pm

PreviousNext

Return to Pittsburgh Penguins

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests

e-mail