November: Do or Die

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November: Do or Die

Postby Hugo Stiglitz on Fri Nov 15, 2013 11:50 am

Looking over the rest of this month has really put things into perspective: Even though it's early, the rest of this month could dictate the rest of the season for the Pens.

Current Situation:

- 3 game losing streak

- can't buy goals

- 10 games in the next 2 1/2 weeks

- Missing our two best dmen

- Washington, NYR and Carolina all within three points of the Pens.

The Penguins can quickly fall to fourth or five place in the division if they don't win 75% of the games remaining this month. Luckily the aforementioned teams don't have easy schedules their next ten games either, but if the Pens are to stay afloat, they need to do better than break even.

The Pens were once sitting pretty in a division that looked thin and weak, but these teams are all coming together now and finding their games.

I'm not saying I believe the Penguins won't make the playoffs, but if things don't go right this month they're going to find themselves playing catch-up and chasing that 7th or 8th spot.

It may seem premature for me to be saying this it being so early in the season, but with the current situation it's really not. This could all create a very serious problem if the Pens can't find a way to start scoring.
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Re: November: Do or Die

Postby Pitts on Fri Nov 15, 2013 12:11 pm

The Pens will make the playoffs, but their play to date has to be a major concern. They have far too much talent to be playing like they are and letting teams win games over them. Personally, I think they need a coaching change. That won't happen, so I don't know what the answer is. The DB simply doesn't seem willing or able to get them to play a different game.
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Re: November: Do or Die

Postby Hugo Stiglitz on Fri Nov 15, 2013 12:16 pm

Pitts wrote:The Pens will make the playoffs, but their play to date has to be a major concern. They have far too much talent to be playing like they are and letting teams win games over them. Personally, I think they need a coaching change. That won't happen, so I don't know what the answer is. The DB simply doesn't seem willing or able to get them to play a different game.


I also believe the Pens will make the playoffs, but allowing this month to get away from them could cause them to be fighting for a spot rather than be a lock. While some might say that doesn't matter as long as they make the playoffs, it matters because they aren't a team that should be struggling the way they are.
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Re: November: Do or Die

Postby sil on Fri Nov 15, 2013 12:19 pm

Hugo Stiglitz wrote:Looking over the rest of this month has really put things into perspective: Even though it's early, the rest of this month could dictate the rest of the season for the Pens.

Current Situation:

- 3 game losing streak

- can't buy goals

- 10 games in the next 2 1/2 weeks

- Missing our two best dmen

- Washington, NYR and Carolina all within three points of the Pens.


Yep. Don't ya just love the ups and downs of a full regular season!
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Re: November: Do or Die

Postby Hugo Stiglitz on Fri Nov 15, 2013 12:24 pm

sil wrote:
Hugo Stiglitz wrote:Looking over the rest of this month has really put things into perspective: Even though it's early, the rest of this month could dictate the rest of the season for the Pens.

Current Situation:

- 3 game losing streak

- can't buy goals

- 10 games in the next 2 1/2 weeks

- Missing our two best dmen

- Washington, NYR and Carolina all within three points of the Pens.


Yep. Don't ya just love the ups and downs of a full regular season!



This is more than just ups and downs. Signs are not pointing in a good direction and while I don't believe the Pens have to dominate all the time and be the 1st seed, it's unsettling to see things unravel. This shouldn't be a team struggling for a playoff spot and they've put themselves in the position for that happen very quickly.
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Re: November: Do or Die

Postby Hugo Stiglitz on Fri Nov 15, 2013 12:28 pm

I'm not trying to a be a "sky is falling" just because of three losses...

I just think we're seeing a steady unraveling that started in the playoffs. The Pens' issues with their play has been like a wound that gets more and more exposed.

This is just not a new story for the Pens; it's just becoming more common now.
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Re: November: Do or Die

Postby sil on Fri Nov 15, 2013 12:29 pm

This team simply isn't as good as some in previous years...and the cap structure/ceiling has a lot to do with it. Also, I don't like a three game losing streak as much as the next person, but describing this current team as "unravel(ing)" is a bit of a stretch to me.

On another note, the last time this team found themselves fighting hard to make the playoffs and fighting tooth-n-nail every night...the calender read 2009...and that was a pretty good year if I recall.
Last edited by sil on Fri Nov 15, 2013 12:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: November: Do or Die

Postby Steve on Fri Nov 15, 2013 12:31 pm

sil wrote:
Hugo Stiglitz wrote:Looking over the rest of this month has really put things into perspective: Even though it's early, the rest of this month could dictate the rest of the season for the Pens.

Current Situation:

- 3 game losing streak

- can't buy goals

- 10 games in the next 2 1/2 weeks

- Missing our two best dmen

- Washington, NYR and Carolina all within three points of the Pens.


Yep. Don't ya just love the ups and downs of a full regular season!


Exactly - I think we'll see another losing streak this season, but there will be alot more ups than downs.

The Pens do need to break out of this funk though - I suspect we'll see some more inspired/smarter play tonight.
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Re: November: Do or Die

Postby Hugo Stiglitz on Fri Nov 15, 2013 12:33 pm

sil wrote:This team simply isn't as good as some in previous years...and the cap structure/ceiling has a lot to do with it. Also, I don't like a three game losing streak as much as the next person, but describing this current team as "unravel(ing)" is a bit of a stretch to me.

On another note, the last time this team found themselves fighting hard to make the playoffs and fighting tooth-n-nail every night...the calender read 2009...and that was a pretty good year if I recall.


I could be stretching it, but I'm seeing the problems that plagued them in the playoffs last year showing themselves much sooner this year.

I also disagree that this team isn't as good as previous years. The third line may not be as potent, but I think we have better dmen than previous teams.
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Re: November: Do or Die

Postby sil on Fri Nov 15, 2013 12:37 pm

Hugo Stiglitz wrote:
sil wrote:This team simply isn't as good as some in previous years...and the cap structure/ceiling has a lot to do with it. Also, I don't like a three game losing streak as much as the next person, but describing this current team as "unravel(ing)" is a bit of a stretch to me.

On another note, the last time this team found themselves fighting hard to make the playoffs and fighting tooth-n-nail every night...the calender read 2009...and that was a pretty good year if I recall.


I could be stretching it, but I'm seeing the problems that plagued them in the playoffs last year showing themselves much sooner this year.

I also disagree that this team isn't as good as previous years. The third line may not be as potent, but I think we have better dmen than previous teams.


I think the STL game was reminicent of the B's series, but the pens were actually pretty sound and patient in that game the other night...which was good to see. They generated many chances against both the Rags and the Flyers, and I've a hard time seeing the same impatience and frustration that I saw last spring against Boston. Perhaps I'm being too easy on them though.
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Re: November: Do or Die

Postby MRandall25 on Fri Nov 15, 2013 12:39 pm

Steve wrote:
sil wrote:
Hugo Stiglitz wrote:Looking over the rest of this month has really put things into perspective: Even though it's early, the rest of this month could dictate the rest of the season for the Pens.

Current Situation:

- 3 game losing streak

- can't buy goals

- 10 games in the next 2 1/2 weeks

- Missing our two best dmen

- Washington, NYR and Carolina all within three points of the Pens.


Yep. Don't ya just love the ups and downs of a full regular season!


Exactly - I think we'll see another losing streak this season, but there will be alot more ups than downs.

The Pens do need to break out of this funk though - I suspect we'll see some more inspired/smarter play tonight.


I still remember last year. The Pens lost two or three in a row, everyone freaked out, and then they won a few, then had a 14 game winning streak. Such is the regular season. Such is hockey. Anything can happen.

You're going to see some growing pains with the added defensive system of Jacques Martin to go along with the Bylsma offense. It's still relatively early enough in the year to work the inevitable kinks out of it.

If losing a few games in a row at the beginning of the year helps us refine the team's game before the playoffs, I'm not going to complain.
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Re: November: Do or Die

Postby Hugo Stiglitz on Fri Nov 15, 2013 12:43 pm

MRandall25 wrote:
Steve wrote:
sil wrote:
Hugo Stiglitz wrote:Looking over the rest of this month has really put things into perspective: Even though it's early, the rest of this month could dictate the rest of the season for the Pens.

Current Situation:

- 3 game losing streak

- can't buy goals

- 10 games in the next 2 1/2 weeks

- Missing our two best dmen

- Washington, NYR and Carolina all within three points of the Pens.


Yep. Don't ya just love the ups and downs of a full regular season!


Exactly - I think we'll see another losing streak this season, but there will be alot more ups than downs.

The Pens do need to break out of this funk though - I suspect we'll see some more inspired/smarter play tonight.


I still remember last year. The Pens lost two or three in a row, everyone freaked out, and then they won a few, then had a 14 game winning streak. Such is the regular season. Such is hockey. Anything can happen.

You're going to see some growing pains with the added defensive system of Jacques Martin to go along with the Bylsma offense. It's still relatively early enough in the year to work the inevitable kinks out of it.

If losing a few games in a row at the beginning of the year helps us refine the team's game before the playoffs, I'm not going to complain.


The difference here is that the Pens had such a good start to the season last year that they built themselves a much better cushion than they have now. It's all about timing and this is a bad time for a losing streak when you have teams finally finding their game while you're letting your get away.
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Re: November: Do or Die

Postby Hugo Stiglitz on Fri Nov 15, 2013 12:45 pm

sil wrote:
Hugo Stiglitz wrote:
sil wrote:This team simply isn't as good as some in previous years...and the cap structure/ceiling has a lot to do with it. Also, I don't like a three game losing streak as much as the next person, but describing this current team as "unravel(ing)" is a bit of a stretch to me.

On another note, the last time this team found themselves fighting hard to make the playoffs and fighting tooth-n-nail every night...the calender read 2009...and that was a pretty good year if I recall.


I could be stretching it, but I'm seeing the problems that plagued them in the playoffs last year showing themselves much sooner this year.

I also disagree that this team isn't as good as previous years. The third line may not be as potent, but I think we have better dmen than previous teams.


I think the STL game was reminicent of the B's series, but the pens were actually pretty sound and patient in that game the other night...which was good to see. They generated many chances against both the Rags and the Flyers, and I've a hard time seeing the same impatience and frustration that I saw last spring against Boston. Perhaps I'm being too easy on them though.


The STL game was definitely reminiscent of the B's series and that's not a good thing. If the Penguins are still having the same problems then it means they're continuing to not address them.

Again, I know it's super early in the season but timing couldn't be worse. I'm also not saying it's going to get bad, but that they're in a very tough position right now to where it could slip away very easily.
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Re: November: Do or Die

Postby slappybrown on Fri Nov 15, 2013 12:49 pm

but that they're in a very tough position right now to where it could slip away very easily.


No, no it can't.
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Re: November: Do or Die

Postby MRandall25 on Fri Nov 15, 2013 12:49 pm

I disagree with that notion (that we had a better cushion last year).

The Fire DB thread was posted January 25th. The Pens were 2-2, and people were worried because we lost 5-2 to the Leafs and 4-2 to the Jets.

The Pens were 4-3 in January last year, and there was much less room for error with the shortened season. It wasn't exactly a strong start. At least, it isn't as strong as 11-4 this year. They then won 7 of their next 10 after everyone started :scared: :scared:.

Point is, you can't really take much out of 3 games of an 82 game season, especially with tweaks in the system. There are going to be growing pains. It's a long season. As Phil Bourque says, "Buckle up, baby". The season won't be lost because of 3 games.
Last edited by MRandall25 on Fri Nov 15, 2013 12:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: November: Do or Die

Postby sil on Fri Nov 15, 2013 12:50 pm

Hugo Stiglitz wrote:The STL game was definitely reminiscent of the B's series and that's not a good thing. If the Penguins are still having the same problems then it means they're continuing to not address them.

Again, I know it's super early in the season but timing couldn't be worse. I'm also not saying it's going to get bad, but that they're in a very tough position right now to where it could slip away very easily.


They definitely were more patient against STL though. The team didn't panic...they didn't attempt the same breakouts one after another, they were quite calculated and used multiple looks to try and break STL backcheck...and they didn't sacrifice their defensive play to do it either. And, if you really look at it from a distance, the only reason we didn't get to OT is because of a 1-in-a-dozen lucky deflection goal for Shattenkirk in the third...and one the pens were defensively well set up for. Sometimes the puck-luck just isn't yours.
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Re: November: Do or Die

Postby Hugo Stiglitz on Fri Nov 15, 2013 12:53 pm

sil wrote:
Hugo Stiglitz wrote:The STL game was definitely reminiscent of the B's series and that's not a good thing. If the Penguins are still having the same problems then it means they're continuing to not address them.

Again, I know it's super early in the season but timing couldn't be worse. I'm also not saying it's going to get bad, but that they're in a very tough position right now to where it could slip away very easily.


They definitely were more patient against STL though. The team didn't panic...they didn't attempt the same breakouts one after another, they were quite calculated and used multiple looks to try and break STL backcheck...and they didn't sacrifice their defensive play to do it either. And, if you really look at it from a distance, the only reason we didn't get to OT is because of a 1-in-a-dozen lucky deflection goal for Shattenkirk in the third...and one the pens were defensively well set up for. Sometimes the puck-luck just isn't yours.


I agree with much of what you said, but the issue is the last sentence. How many times have we uttered those words or ones similar to it this year and since the last round of the playoffs?
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Re: November: Do or Die

Postby sil on Fri Nov 15, 2013 1:01 pm

Hugo Stiglitz wrote:
sil wrote:
Hugo Stiglitz wrote:The STL game was definitely reminiscent of the B's series and that's not a good thing. If the Penguins are still having the same problems then it means they're continuing to not address them.

Again, I know it's super early in the season but timing couldn't be worse. I'm also not saying it's going to get bad, but that they're in a very tough position right now to where it could slip away very easily.


They definitely were more patient against STL though. The team didn't panic...they didn't attempt the same breakouts one after another, they were quite calculated and used multiple looks to try and break STL backcheck...and they didn't sacrifice their defensive play to do it either. And, if you really look at it from a distance, the only reason we didn't get to OT is because of a 1-in-a-dozen lucky deflection goal for Shattenkirk in the third...and one the pens were defensively well set up for. Sometimes the puck-luck just isn't yours.


I agree with much of what you said, but the issue is the last sentence. How many times have we uttered those words or ones similar to it this year and since the last round of the playoffs?


I wouldn't have uttered it in the playoffs last year. The pens did nothing to create their own puck-luck. As many of us saw, and were bewildered at, the pens just kept trying the same breakout, over and over and over, and kept seeing the B's stomp it out.

And the Rags loss wasn't puck-luck either. That was just good ol' fashioned pens playing with their heads up their own butts hockey...which also happens every so often in an 82-game season.
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Re: November: Do or Die

Postby Steve on Fri Nov 15, 2013 1:02 pm

MRandall25 wrote:
Steve wrote:
sil wrote:
Hugo Stiglitz wrote:Looking over the rest of this month has really put things into perspective: Even though it's early, the rest of this month could dictate the rest of the season for the Pens.

Current Situation:

- 3 game losing streak

- can't buy goals

- 10 games in the next 2 1/2 weeks

- Missing our two best dmen

- Washington, NYR and Carolina all within three points of the Pens.


Yep. Don't ya just love the ups and downs of a full regular season!


Exactly - I think we'll see another losing streak this season, but there will be alot more ups than downs.

The Pens do need to break out of this funk though - I suspect we'll see some more inspired/smarter play tonight.


I still remember last year. The Pens lost two or three in a row, everyone freaked out, and then they won a few, then had a 14 game winning streak. Such is the regular season. Such is hockey. Anything can happen.

You're going to see some growing pains with the added defensive system of Jacques Martin to go along with the Bylsma offense. It's still relatively early enough in the year to work the inevitable kinks out of it.

If losing a few games in a row at the beginning of the year helps us refine the team's game before the playoffs, I'm not going to complain.


Yeah, i'm not at all worried about this losing streak - for the most part, I really like this team, and I think we're really fortunate as fans.

I agree with others who suggest we're playing too soft right now - but I think this team won't play soft in the playoffs, and Shero will address team toughness a bit at the trade deadline.
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Re: November: Do or Die

Postby SolidSnake on Fri Nov 15, 2013 1:11 pm

If you live by Dan Bylsma mantra this team will get to their game and everything's gonna be alright
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Re: November: Do or Die

Postby nocera on Fri Nov 15, 2013 4:31 pm

It's almost like we've forgotten that an NHL season is 82 games long. The Penguins have played 18.
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Re: November: Do or Die

Postby SolidSnake on Fri Nov 15, 2013 4:59 pm

I can't wait for back to back losses this weekend
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Re: November: Do or Die

Postby Hugo Stiglitz on Fri Nov 15, 2013 5:29 pm

nocera wrote:It's almost like we've forgotten that an NHL season is 82 games long. The Penguins have played 18.


I think this thread went the wrong direction that I was intending. I'm not saying the sky is falling.

All I'm saying that while it's early, the rest of this month could very well dictate the rest of the season for the Pens. It's just a matter of timing and the state of affairs with the Penguins play.

If the Penguins can win six or seven of the next ten games then they'll be in good shape. Continuing to skid with so many games coming up and other teams playing better can quickly put the Penguins in the position of having to fight for a playoff spot. Remember that there's a new playoff format.

If the Penguins lose their next two games and either the Caps or Rangers win theirs, the Pens drop immediately from 1st to 3rd and that's if Carolina doesn't win.
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Re: November: Do or Die

Postby penny lane on Fri Nov 15, 2013 6:03 pm

Isn't the regular season suppose to be their season? ;) :P

It takes a secure person to be able to change and admit errors and try something new.
Coach Disco = bullheaded stubborn. 8-)
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Re: November: Do or Die

Postby TrueNorth on Fri Nov 15, 2013 6:11 pm

SolidSnake wrote:I can't wait for back to back losses this weekend


Wash your mouth out with soap--immediately!
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