Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

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Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

Postby Penspal on Fri Mar 16, 2018 10:22 am

Pens win 5-3

- Geno got his 40th but could have had at least one other if Rusty had of dropped it for EN or if Geno could have hit it last second
- After Geno got his first point, we saw the gallop that has been missing the last few games... Pens have to play their game, Geno will get his points
- Horny is worth every penny. Not sure in a couple years with the abuse his body takes, but the time is now and he is..... Horny :evil:
- Jarry kept his composure after getting down 2 goals. Against a good team, this woul be a loss. But its not, let's take the W and woooo hooooo
- Sheary is like a waterbug, all over the place but appears to be easily disrupted. As soon as anyone gets healthy, he sits
- Kessel makes me laugh like no other player... he's got so many little oddities, how can you not laugh, top it off with elite talent... :D
- I will be the first to say that I did not see a good pairing between Hagelin and Geno.... But it works, they figured it out :fist:
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Re: Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

Postby Weegie on Fri Mar 16, 2018 11:06 am

When they went down 2-0 I had this sinking feeling and started to doubt Jarry again and kept thinking "when is Murray coming back?", but then realized they have the firepower to come back and they did, but it wasn't easy but then again it was the second of back to back games for about the 4,000th time this season.

I wish that Horny-Malkin-Hags line could play the whole game, they really were cooking last night! And Rust really is playing inspired hockey right now, heating up at the right time, hopefully it is contagious and some others who are a bit cold warm up too!

They got the win, got two points, now get some rest, hopefully Murray is back next week and stays healthy!
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Re: Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

Postby penny lane on Fri Mar 16, 2018 11:27 am

Hornqvist parked at the net is a beautiful sight!
Evgeni- congrats for 40th goal.- More to get!
Another odd longer break- Coach Sullivan has to keep them fresh & focused.
He looked good in his kelly green tie last evening. 40 shades of Ireland.
Image
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Re: Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

Postby E-Ramone on Fri Mar 16, 2018 12:02 pm

During the Rangers game, I noticed Sid would tend to reach for pucks with just his right hand on the stick. I thought this was odd so I was looking for it last night against Montreal. He definitely did this a few times last night too. I'm not sure if he's injured or something's not right with his left hand/wrist/shoulder? In any event his play last night didn't look good to me and hasn't for awhile.
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Re: Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

Postby Daniel on Fri Mar 16, 2018 12:18 pm

Penspal wrote:every penny. Not sure in a couple years with the abuse his body takes, but the time is now and he is..... Horny :evil: :


I think he'll be invaluable for his whole contract. Maybe not as a scorer, but leadership and intangibles. ZAR can hopefully take over his scoring while Hornqvist mans the 4th line and just hits, cycles, and be a clubhouse voice.

I think his leadership far outweighs his 20 goals per year.
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Re: Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

Postby Mango Salsa on Fri Mar 16, 2018 12:44 pm

E-Ramone wrote:During the Rangers game, I noticed Sid would tend to reach for pucks with just his right hand on the stick. I thought this was odd so I was looking for it last night against Montreal. He definitely did this a few times last night too. I'm not sure if he's injured or something's not right with his left hand/wrist/shoulder? In any event his play last night didn't look good to me and hasn't for awhile.


Now that you mention it I think it was in the Dallas game where he took a slash on the hand and was clearly hurt.
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Re: Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

Postby Daniel on Fri Mar 16, 2018 12:52 pm

E-Ramone wrote:During the Rangers game, I noticed Sid would tend to reach for pucks with just his right hand on the stick. I thought this was odd so I was looking for it last night against Montreal. He definitely did this a few times last night too. I'm not sure if he's injured or something's not right with his left hand/wrist/shoulder? In any event his play last night didn't look good to me and hasn't for awhile.


It'd be nice if they can get in a position where the playoffs and seeding are guaranteed and allow players to heal up. Kessel also seems out of sorts since he landed awkwardly a few weeks ago.
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Re: Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

Postby FLPensFan on Fri Mar 16, 2018 1:33 pm

Geno has been pretty dominate all season, whether he played with Kessel, Rust, Hornqvist, or Hagelin.
Brassard line is starting to show signs of being a regular contributor and threat.

Penguins need to figure out how to get Crosby's line going. Worst case scenario, they have to wait until ZAR is back and put him with Sid. Sheary is just a trainwreck, and has been for a good while. You'd hope his two goal game would have broke him out of his funk, but it has not. Guentzel isn't exactly lighting things up either. And honestly, I don't think you can point all of Crosby's line issues on Sheary and Guentzel.....think Sid needs to take a look in the mirror as well. He can't be above the criticism.
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Re: Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

Postby longtimefan on Fri Mar 16, 2018 2:46 pm

FLPensFan wrote:Geno has been pretty dominate all season, whether he played with Kessel, Rust, Hornqvist, or Hagelin.
Brassard line is starting to show signs of being a regular contributor and threat.

Penguins need to figure out how to get Crosby's line going. Worst case scenario, they have to wait until ZAR is back and put him with Sid. Sheary is just a trainwreck, and has been for a good while. You'd hope his two goal game would have broke him out of his funk, but it has not. Guentzel isn't exactly lighting things up either. And honestly, I don't think you can point all of Crosby's line issues on Sheary and Guentzel.....think Sid needs to take a look in the mirror as well. He can't be above the criticism.


This is a nice break at this time of year. They can let some guys heal, and they can actually get in a couple good practices. Sheary has been a disaster, and I agree Sid has to look in the mirror. It may be as simple as Sid isn't a kid anymore. He seems more inconsistent, with very hot and very cold stretches. In his defense, he does seem to be putting the team first, and he's got to play a little different role. Like more PK and defensive zone draws because Malkin and Brassard aren't that great in the circle. He's not at his best though, and I'm sure he knows it. He seems to be making a lot of plays that simply aren't working. Guentzel frustrates me a bit, although he was playing like a madman last night. Errey mentioned it during the game. He broke out of his long slump in a nice way, and seemed to be building real chemistry with Kessel. Rust looks good there right now though. I also agree getting Aston Rees back is key. Right now, Sheary doesn't deserve to dress.
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Re: Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

Postby wondermoose on Fri Mar 16, 2018 3:44 pm

Sid has shifted his entire focus on playing responsible hockey and that has taken a pretty big toll on his offensive production. Watch how low he is in the defensive zone - I think he understands that this lineup is going to score whether he's driving the bus or not, especially since Brassard is starting to look like the player we all know he can be. I don't think he has a lot of confidence in his shot right now either. Nothing is going in whereas everything was going in last year. Whatever, I'm okay with it. That line is still walloping teams in the possession front even if they're not scoring, and I have a gut feeling that they are going to be very advantageous once the playoffs begin. For all the crap Sheary takes, it's no secret he is the support on that line, and if Sid wants to keep a better watch on his own zone then that is going to affect everyone on the line. Another thing I've noticed is, with Sid staying back in the defensive zone, he also isn't carrying pucks out as much, and Sheary and Guentzel aren't nearly as good when it's just them leading up the ice. Again, whatever, they're not getting scored on and that's the biggest thing right now.

Kris Letang is going to ruin this season if he keeps playing this way. For all the preaching he and the coaching staff do of making the smart/simple play, it apparently falls on deaf ears.
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Re: Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

Postby thehockeyguru on Fri Mar 16, 2018 3:54 pm

wondermoose wrote:Kris Letang is going to ruin this season if he keeps playing this way. For all the preaching he and the coaching staff do of making the smart/simple play, it apparently falls on deaf ears.


This is my worry. Say what you want about last years D Corp and how they didnt have any top pairing talent, but they were very smart with the puck and won battles in front of the net.

Letang, Oleksiak, and Ruhwedel is NOT better than Hainsey, Daley, and Cole. I will say it again, when you have a guy like Schultz who is a better PP QB than Letang, Letang is not needed.

A perfect comparison is the Capitals. They had a good D corp and they go out and get a guy like Shattenkirk and after they werent as good defensively. Same applies for Letang.
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Re: Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

Postby wondermoose on Fri Mar 16, 2018 4:01 pm

thehockeyguru wrote:
wondermoose wrote:Kris Letang is going to ruin this season if he keeps playing this way. For all the preaching he and the coaching staff do of making the smart/simple play, it apparently falls on deaf ears.


This is my worry. Say what you want about last years D Corp and how they didnt have any top pairing talent, but they were very smart with the puck and won battles in front of the net.

Letang, Oleksiak, and Ruhwedel is NOT better than Hainsey, Daley, and Cole. I will say it again, when you have a guy like Schultz who is a better PP QB than Letang, Letang is not needed.

A perfect comparison is the Capitals. They had a good D corp and they go out and get a guy like Shattenkirk and after they werent as good defensively. Same applies for Letang.


Meh, power play is whatever. Stats show they do better with Letang up top so that doesn't bother me. It's all about the forwards anyway, and they're so precise in how they score that when it doesn't work, it looks really bad. But they score once out every four tries so whatever.

It's all about potential for this team - if Letang can play even to a small portion of his potential and Oleksiak can keep at his current pace, then this year's defense is light year's ahead of last year's. But you're right - it comes down to the catastrophic mistakes that Letang makes with reckless abandon while everyone last year was capable of making the simple play up to the forwards.
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Re: Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

Postby murphydump55 on Fri Mar 16, 2018 5:13 pm

thehockeyguru wrote:
wondermoose wrote:Kris Letang is going to ruin this season if he keeps playing this way. For all the preaching he and the coaching staff do of making the smart/simple play, it apparently falls on deaf ears.


This is my worry. Say what you want about last years D Corp and how they didnt have any top pairing talent, but they were very smart with the puck and won battles in front of the net.

Letang, Oleksiak, and Ruhwedel is NOT better than Hainsey, Daley, and Cole. I will say it again, when you have a guy like Schultz who is a better PP QB than Letang, Letang is not needed.

A perfect comparison is the Capitals. They had a good D corp and they go out and get a guy like Shattenkirk and after they werent as good defensively. Same applies for Letang.


The problem here is recency bias and how people fall victim to it. (Letang is partially to blame for it too lol)

People were complaining about Letang last night. Here's what the numbers said:

With Letang on the ice 5v5:

Shot attempts for: 24
Shot attempts against: 17

Not bad at all. Oh, but some may say that those 17 attempts against were of the high danger variety.

Scoring chances with Letang on the ice, 5v5:

For: 17
Against: 6

That is absolutely fantastic and he was playing a whale of a game.....until. Letang makes a poor decision with the puck, gets forechecked, causes a turnover and a goal. This is his biggest problem this year, he plays a great game but has these spurts of horrid play that result in a goal against or sustained pressure against. They don't last long, but they are very glaring, hence people remembering them and forgetting all the great stuff he did.

The ice was absolutely tilted in the Pens favour every time he was on the ice last night, but then the aforementioned happens and everyone goes into pitchfork mode. (I wasn't happy either, don't get me wrong)

As per Jesse Marshall:

Letang has the lowest shot attempts against of any D on the team.
Also has the lowest expected goals against of any D on the team.
Has limited scoring chances against better than any D on the team.

He does this against the top lines every night. That's damn good. If he can clean up the stupid decisions that overshadow the good stuff, we'll be much better off. Recency bias can be very misleading as to the overall picture, I've fallen victim to it as a coach numerous times. After watching game tape and looking at the numbers, I realize I'm forgetting a lot of good things.
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Re: Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

Postby thehockeyguru on Fri Mar 16, 2018 5:58 pm

murphydump55 wrote:
thehockeyguru wrote:
wondermoose wrote:Kris Letang is going to ruin this season if he keeps playing this way. For all the preaching he and the coaching staff do of making the smart/simple play, it apparently falls on deaf ears.


This is my worry. Say what you want about last years D Corp and how they didnt have any top pairing talent, but they were very smart with the puck and won battles in front of the net.

Letang, Oleksiak, and Ruhwedel is NOT better than Hainsey, Daley, and Cole. I will say it again, when you have a guy like Schultz who is a better PP QB than Letang, Letang is not needed.

A perfect comparison is the Capitals. They had a good D corp and they go out and get a guy like Shattenkirk and after they werent as good defensively. Same applies for Letang.


The problem here is recency bias and how people fall victim to it. (Letang is partially to blame for it too lol)

People were complaining about Letang last night. Here's what the numbers said:

With Letang on the ice 5v5:

Shot attempts for: 24
Shot attempts against: 17

Not bad at all. Oh, but some may say that those 17 attempts against were of the high danger variety.

Scoring chances with Letang on the ice, 5v5:

For: 17
Against: 6

That is absolutely fantastic and he was playing a whale of a game.....until. Letang makes a poor decision with the puck, gets forechecked, causes a turnover and a goal. This is his biggest problem this year, he plays a great game but has these spurts of horrid play that result in a goal against or sustained pressure against. They don't last long, but they are very glaring, hence people remembering them and forgetting all the great stuff he did.

The ice was absolutely tilted in the Pens favour every time he was on the ice last night, but then the aforementioned happens and everyone goes into pitchfork mode. (I wasn't happy either, don't get me wrong)

As per Jesse Marshall:

Letang has the lowest shot attempts against of any D on the team.
Also has the lowest expected goals against of any D on the team.
Has limited scoring chances against better than any D on the team.

He does this against the top lines every night. That's damn good. If he can clean up the stupid decisions that overshadow the good stuff, we'll be much better off. Recency bias can be very misleading as to the overall picture, I've fallen victim to it as a coach numerous times. After watching game tape and looking at the numbers, I realize I'm forgetting a lot of good things.


That is exactly why I take steady guys like we had last year. They arent flashy but make the smart play. I dont care about all the advanced stats that show Letang is playing well, all i need are my eyes to see the one bone head play that he makes every game that changes the momentum and shape of the game.
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Re: Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

Postby murphydump55 on Fri Mar 16, 2018 6:38 pm

thehockeyguru wrote:
murphydump55 wrote:
thehockeyguru wrote:
wondermoose wrote:Kris Letang is going to ruin this season if he keeps playing this way. For all the preaching he and the coaching staff do of making the smart/simple play, it apparently falls on deaf ears.


This is my worry. Say what you want about last years D Corp and how they didnt have any top pairing talent, but they were very smart with the puck and won battles in front of the net.

Letang, Oleksiak, and Ruhwedel is NOT better than Hainsey, Daley, and Cole. I will say it again, when you have a guy like Schultz who is a better PP QB than Letang, Letang is not needed.

A perfect comparison is the Capitals. They had a good D corp and they go out and get a guy like Shattenkirk and after they werent as good defensively. Same applies for Letang.


The problem here is recency bias and how people fall victim to it. (Letang is partially to blame for it too lol)

People were complaining about Letang last night. Here's what the numbers said:

With Letang on the ice 5v5:

Shot attempts for: 24
Shot attempts against: 17

Not bad at all. Oh, but some may say that those 17 attempts against were of the high danger variety.

Scoring chances with Letang on the ice, 5v5:

For: 17
Against: 6

That is absolutely fantastic and he was playing a whale of a game.....until. Letang makes a poor decision with the puck, gets forechecked, causes a turnover and a goal. This is his biggest problem this year, he plays a great game but has these spurts of horrid play that result in a goal against or sustained pressure against. They don't last long, but they are very glaring, hence people remembering them and forgetting all the great stuff he did.

The ice was absolutely tilted in the Pens favour every time he was on the ice last night, but then the aforementioned happens and everyone goes into pitchfork mode. (I wasn't happy either, don't get me wrong)

As per Jesse Marshall:

Letang has the lowest shot attempts against of any D on the team.
Also has the lowest expected goals against of any D on the team.
Has limited scoring chances against better than any D on the team.

He does this against the top lines every night. That's damn good. If he can clean up the stupid decisions that overshadow the good stuff, we'll be much better off. Recency bias can be very misleading as to the overall picture, I've fallen victim to it as a coach numerous times. After watching game tape and looking at the numbers, I realize I'm forgetting a lot of good things.


That is exactly why I take steady guys like we had last year. They arent flashy but make the smart play. I dont care about all the advanced stats that show Letang is playing well, all i need are my eyes to see the one bone head play that he makes every game that changes the momentum and shape of the game.


You do realize that he is part of the reason the Pens score and sustain pressure too? He has the ability to flip the game the other way too.

For those that like plus minus and were pointing to his team worst plus minus earlier this year...he's now -5. Much improved from where he was earlier this season and not a team worst anymore.

Don't get me wrong, Letang frustrates the crap out of me too at times, but I've learned to realize that a lot of good things happen when he's on the ice A lot. The problem is his ability to make stupid errors that end up being glaring ones. Hopefully they stop overshadowing the good things that happen while he's on the ice.

.....but get him off the power play.
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Re: Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

Postby thehockeyguru on Fri Mar 16, 2018 6:55 pm

What I do know is the Pens do not need Letang to win a Cup. Time will tell if Letangs stretches of gopd play are enough to overshadow his inevitable mistakes.
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Re: Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

Postby Daniel on Fri Mar 16, 2018 6:59 pm

thehockeyguru wrote:What I do know is the Pens do not need Letang to win a Cup. Time will tell if Letangs stretches of gopd play are enough to overshadow his inevitable mistakes.


It's a shame because when he's on he's a sure bet hall of famer. When he isn't, he's Mike Green who shoots against shin pads.
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Re: Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

Postby Puck-Lurker on Fri Mar 16, 2018 7:04 pm

- Letang irritates me to no end at times. He'd be a massively better player if he'd acquired Olli's sense of danger. Yes, I get his plus side. It's that his down sides are so obvious and correctable (which he doesn't) that irks.
- D&G flubbing around at time. That costs goals.
- Brassard, as Sheahan before him, will take time. Much more than you'd like, but he'll click. Rust on that line is a serious improvement over Sheary, Simon and Guentzel.
- As much as Sheary is making a case for himself to sit, he was reasonably useful for once, in a bottom 4 chase and grind type. Like a Hagelin with less speed and less scoring ability and no PK.
- Guentzel deserves stick too. Yes, he's working and he's active. But you can get Kühnhackl to do that kinda thing.
- I'm convinced Crosby and Kessel are injured. I've no idea what, it's there. Crosby's gone very cold. Makes sense if he's got an UBI.
- Kühnhackl should play over Rowney. Good lord, that guy's absolute fearless at shot blocking. He's like a defensive Hörnqvist.

A win's a win, but we're not always going to be playing against Niemi, who has a habit of taking four goals against when the Pens play.
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Re: Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

Postby Henry Hank on Fri Mar 16, 2018 7:33 pm

That is exactly why I take steady guys like we had last year. They arent flashy but make the smart play. I dont care about all the advanced stats that show Letang is playing well, all i need are my eyes to see the one bone head play that he makes every game that changes the momentum and shape of the game.


That’s actually why the advanced stats are so useful. Otherwise people let their human instincts take over and you let one bad play tell you that a player is bad when the objective data says he’s not.

Letang is frustrating because he’s a Norris-level defenseman when he’s on. But let’s please appreciate what we have here. He’s a very good player. It’s ironic because when he went down last year, immediately the popular opinion was that the Pens could not win a Cup without him. And the popular opinion was that Hainsey was a poor fit here. We all saw how much the transition game struggled without Letang. Now he’s back and everyone has resumed trashing him which is deserved to a small degree at times, but please.
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Re: Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

Postby Henry Hank on Fri Mar 16, 2018 7:44 pm

Penguins need to figure out how to get Crosby's line going.


Yes and no. I do agree that it would be ideal to have his line clicking consistently, but I don’t think they should make it top priority. Right now, Malkin and Kessel lines are working well. They shouldn’t do anything to disrupt that to get Crosby going. Like, I’ve seen it suggested that Kessel should play with Crosby for that purpose, but I think that weakens the Pens’ attack. Their biggest strength is going to be having Crosby, Malkin, and Kessel separate and creating match-up nightmares. If teams are still devoting top defensive man power to stopping Crosby and that’s leaving a favorable match-up for the third line, that’s a win for the Pens strategically. Or if they back off Sid’s line then it’s likely that it suddenly becomes more threatening (eg against the Flyers last week).
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Re: Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

Postby Faubert5 on Fri Mar 16, 2018 7:53 pm

Henry Hank wrote:
Penguins need to figure out how to get Crosby's line going.


Yes and no. I do agree that it would be ideal to have his line clicking consistently, but I don’t think they should make it top priority. Right now, Malkin and Kessel lines are working well. They shouldn’t do anything to disrupt that to get Crosby going. Like, I’ve seen it suggested that Kessel should play with Crosby for that purpose, but I think that weakens the Pens’ attack. Their biggest strength is going to be having Crosby, Malkin, and Kessel separate and creating match-up nightmares. If teams are still devoting top defensive man power to stopping Crosby and that’s leaving a favorable match-up for the third line, that’s a win for the Pens strategically. Or if they back off Sid’s line then it’s likely that it suddenly becomes more threatening (eg against the Flyers last week).


Get ZAR back and put him or Rusty up with Sid. As you say, I wouldn't mess with Geno's line or the third if they click. Which would mean ZAR on Sid's line if the third gets going.

If Geno wants to win the scoring race, he needs to shoot more on the power play. That cannon is going to lead to goals and rebounds.
Last edited by Faubert5 on Sat Mar 17, 2018 3:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

Postby Malkintent on Sat Mar 17, 2018 1:13 am

Who's D&G?
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Re: Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

Postby Puck-Lurker on Sat Mar 17, 2018 3:40 am

Malkintent wrote:Who's D&G?

Anyone not a forward
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Re: Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

Postby ziggo on Sat Mar 17, 2018 8:36 am

The odds are highly against the Pens winning a second Cup without Letang. Plus they just don't have the depth they had last year. Hunwick would need to have an epiphany and Oleksiak continue to improve. I have this funny feeling , you will see Brassard really turn the corner in the playoffs and have a major impact.
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Re: Game 72 vs Habs - Thoughts from the Morning After

Postby Penspal on Sat Mar 17, 2018 9:39 am

Puck-Lurker wrote:- Letang irritates me to no end at times.


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