Which players to keep for next season?

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Postby conforto45 on Mon Feb 06, 2006 5:02 pm

can Morosov come back next year?

As much as I hate to say it.. he would be an improvement to this team.

Crosby is showing the ability to make people around him look good... Morosov w/ him and Surovy?

Morosov kind of reminds me of KK. But better talented.
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Postby Defence21 on Mon Feb 06, 2006 5:22 pm

conforto45 wrote:can Morosov come back next year?

As much as I hate to say it.. he would be an improvement to this team.

Crosby is showing the ability to make people around him look good... Morosov w/ him and Surovy?

Morosov kind of reminds me of KK. But better talented.


Yes he can, but he will be an unrestricted free agent. So what would be the point? I mean we know what he can do and has done. He is a good player at times, and invisible at others. I'd much rather see the Pens go out and look for another young scoring winger free agent -- someone with size and grit. Sure, these guys cost a lot, but they are worth it.

One of the problems I think the Pens had last offseason was that they chose to go with extreme youth and extreme age. The free agents they brought in -- a few aside -- mainly were 33 or older. Knowing from experience, it is difficult to gel on and off the ice when there is such an age discrepincy. They have very few middle-aged players to kind of act as mediators.

At age 18, Crosby has next to nothing in common with guys old enough to be his dad -- Lemieux, Recchi, Leclair, Odelein, Poapst. But he'd have more in common with a 27 year old, such as Samsonov.

My point is that, in order to play as a team on the ice, players should be friends or sociable off the ice. I'm not trying to suggest a locker room rift. But I am suggesting that the young players have absolutely no reason to pal around with the older players, and vice versa.

The Pens would be smart to add a few middle-ages free agents this summer to bridge the gap. But we'll see if this happens.
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Postby Mad City Mike on Mon Feb 06, 2006 5:37 pm

Defence21 wrote:The Pens would be smart to add a few middle-ages free agents this summer to bridge the gap. But we'll see if this happens.


Unfortunately, this is very hard to do. The age for UFA is maybe 31 under the new CBA. So most UFAs will be older. The only younger guys you can get are those who are cut loose for whatever reason (salary arbitrationa wards, etc.). So you generally have to get those guys in trades. That's why I think the Pens would be smart to at least dangle their top pick and see what teams might offer.
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Postby MrKnowNothing on Mon Feb 06, 2006 5:43 pm

DelPen wrote:
MrKnowNothing wrote:
Knowing the Pens, they will draft him and rush him to the NHL and ruin him.


The only person they did it with ever was maybe Fleury. Crosby was ready, Whitney was ready and everyone else was well seasoned in WBS before getting the call up.

Unless of course you think there's some other players who were rushed? If anything this organization waits too long or never gives players chances like Kraft and Beech after Lang left.


I thought I made it kind of obvious that my comment was made tongue in cheeck. It was meant to be more of a sarcastic jab than a serious gripe with the team, and actually, even then, I don't really know what I was saying.

You, screib, and MCM are right.

Regardless, some are saying that Johnson could play in the NHL next year. I don't know if that would be a wise decision on the Pens part, because Whitney is faultering right now, and a lot of that might be blamed on the lack of good players surrounding him.

Essentially what I am getting at is that we needed a Wade Redden type to be the top defensemen and leader for the young guys, not Sergei Gonchar. Putting all these young defensemen in roles that they have not experienced in the NHL is a recipe for disaster when you don't have at least someone who can cover for them consistently.
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Postby Tocchet on Mon Feb 06, 2006 6:25 pm

If the top line next year is Surovy-Crosby-Armstrong, God save the Queen.

This team needs much more top-line level help at forward. Sure, Malkin will help, but he'll be a rookie playing for the first time in North America, not speaking the language and trying to adapt to American culture. That's a whole heckuva lot harder than what Sid has had to overcome.

Besides those negating factors, the Pens will then have two legitimate top-line forwards. I still don't know what Recchi's contract status is for next year or whether the Pens would want him back if he's as bad with the young players as has been rumored. But Surovy and Ouellet obviously have holes in their games and can't be just given top line spots if the team expects to be a playoff contender. They'll need to strike into the free agency market and acquire some top talent, and it would be great if such talent was Russian to assist Malkin's transition to the NHL.

On defense, Cross also is signed through next year, so he'll be around unless the team can deal him between now and then. I'm pretty sure that Melichar also is under contract, although I don't know what Cairns' contract status is.

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Orpik-Lannon
x. Cross, Melichar
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Postby Defence21 on Mon Feb 06, 2006 6:44 pm

Mad City Mike wrote:Unfortunately, this is very hard to do. The age for UFA is maybe 31 under the new CBA. So most UFAs will be older. The only younger guys you can get are those who are cut loose for whatever reason (salary arbitrationa wards, etc.). So you generally have to get those guys in trades. That's why I think the Pens would be smart to at least dangle their top pick and see what teams might offer.


I thought free agency was set at age 27 or somewhere just around there? Did I miss something? If it is 31, then I take back everything I said. It would be very difficult for the Pens to add to the team by picking up castoffs.

Anyway, I am with you about the pick. What could it hurt to dangle the pick? There could be plenty of instances where a team wants a specific player and would be willing to give up someone special for him. There are plenty of dumb general managers out there. The trick is to find them and then dupe them into something stupid. Ottawa did this several years back with the Islanders. They traded Yashin and got the top pick (Spezza), Chara and I believe Redden.

It won't be easy, and the Pens might have to include a respectable prospect, but the return for the top pick could be tremendous if circumstances are just right.
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Postby NIN on Mon Feb 06, 2006 8:32 pm

Defence21 wrote:
conforto45 wrote:can Morosov come back next year?

As much as I hate to say it.. he would be an improvement to this team.

Crosby is showing the ability to make people around him look good... Morosov w/ him and Surovy?

Morosov kind of reminds me of KK. But better talented.


Yes he can, but he will be an unrestricted free agent. So what would be the point? I mean we know what he can do and has done. He is a good player at times, and invisible at others. I'd much rather see the Pens go out and look for another young scoring winger free agent -- someone with size and grit. Sure, these guys cost a lot, but they are worth it.

One of the problems I think the Pens had last offseason was that they chose to go with extreme youth and extreme age. The free agents they brought in -- a few aside -- mainly were 33 or older. Knowing from experience, it is difficult to gel on and off the ice when there is such an age discrepincy. They have very few middle-aged players to kind of act as mediators.

At age 18, Crosby has next to nothing in common with guys old enough to be his dad -- Lemieux, Recchi, Leclair, Odelein, Poapst. But he'd have more in common with a 27 year old, such as Samsonov.

My point is that, in order to play as a team on the ice, players should be friends or sociable off the ice. I'm not trying to suggest a locker room rift. But I am suggesting that the young players have absolutely no reason to pal around with the older players, and vice versa.

The Pens would be smart to add a few middle-ages free agents this summer to bridge the gap. But we'll see if this happens.


Some good points there but I would like to add that Morozov could help accelerate Malkin's adjusting period. Gonchar and Koltsov should help alittle with the language barrier but Morozov could be his line-mate and I am curious to see what he can do under the new rules.

Bottom line: if they sign him for 1.5 or less for 1 or 2 years tops, it would be a good revisiting to the Morozov experiment. If for some reason Malkin doesnt come over again forget it.
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Postby Defence21 on Mon Feb 06, 2006 8:37 pm

NIN wrote:Some good points there but I would like to add that Morozov could help accelerate Malkin's adjusting period. Gonchar and Koltsov should help alittle with the language barrier but Morozov could be his line-mate and I am curious to see what he can do under the new rules.

Bottom line: if they sign him for 1.5 or less for 1 or 2 years tops, it would be a good revisiting to the Morozov experiment. If for some reason Malkin doesnt come over again forget it.


My only prolem with this is that some team is going to offer him more. I really think there will be some interest around the league with his recent RSL performance and the fact that he has proven to be good, yet inconsistent in the NHL. If he comes at the price you mention, I might be accepting of it. Otherwise, I'd rather see some more physical players come this way.
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we should try with Morozov

Postby Pens4Life on Tue Feb 07, 2006 12:52 pm

try line with Surovy - Malkin - Morozov good 2nd line
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Re: we should try with Morozov

Postby netwolf on Tue Feb 07, 2006 12:58 pm

Pens4Life wrote:try line with Surovy - Malkin - Morozov good 2nd line

Morozov's Penguins career is over. HE is an UFA after this year and then Pens are not going to bid against anyone for him, and that's assuming he wants to return to the NHL.
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Postby Pitts on Tue Feb 07, 2006 1:40 pm

Defence21 wrote:I thought free agency was set at age 27 or somewhere just around there? Did I miss something? If it is 31, then I take back everything I said. It would be very difficult for the Pens to add to the team by picking up castoffs.


With the new CBA, I believe this year it drops to 30, and then down 1 year as the deal progresses, eventually landing at 28. So, UFA is not in the cards.
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Postby PensFanBryan on Tue Feb 07, 2006 2:39 pm

DelPen wrote:
PensFanBryan wrote:Why does everyone keep posting the same lines as this season. We are losing this season... why would we want to keep the same players? This thread is about who you want to keep for next season.


Just because we all pretty much want to see Leclair gone doesn't mean he will be gone. You do understand NHL contracts are garunteed and we can't just cut him, right? Most of the guys we all want to be gone are under contract next year so we will be looking at the same team with a few tweaks like adding Malkin and Welch but other than that...
]

yes I realize the contracts are guranteed, but im assuming they get rid of a couple people. Leclair hopefully will be gone at the trading deadline. He has no desire to be here, and he isnt doing much. I wouldnt mind seeing the Pens buyout Leclair's contract if we cant get rid of him.
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Postby Pipes Hochuli on Tue Feb 07, 2006 3:17 pm

Kicksave wrote:
Peter wrote:Keep recchi, because who else will do the recchi hop hop hop?
keep LeClair because he screens goalies
trade crosby and gonchar for ovechkin
go into russia and kidnap malkin
keep orpik for Sharon
keep malone in his hometown
keep surovy because he's that damn good
keep caron


There is no reason why you shouldn't have an NHL job right now :roll:

</sarcasm>


...you forgot to add that malone's pops is he head scout :lol:
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Postby Daniel on Tue Feb 07, 2006 3:43 pm

"Draft Kessel or Frolik if you have a top 2 pick."

I think the best way to look at who to draft first is to figure out the dropoff at each position for pick 31.

I would imagine the dropoff between Johnson and whoever the best defensemen at pick 31 is a whole lot bigger than Kessel/Frolik and a forward at pick 31.

Therefore, you get a stud defensemen in round one and a blue chip forward in round two, rather than a stud forward in round one and a good defensemen in round two.

Especially since the Penguins have a more pressing need for a guy like Johnson.
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Postby Henry Hank on Tue Feb 07, 2006 8:31 pm

Definite Keepers: Colby Armstrong, Erik Christensen, Sidney Crosby, Ryan Malone, Michel Ouellet, Tomas Surovy, Maxime Talbot, Brooks Orpik, Ryan Whitney, Marc-Andre Fleury

Guys we're pretty much stuck with who could contribute: Sebastien Caron/Jocelyn Thibault, Sergei Gonchar, Mark Recchi, Andre Roy

Youngsters to add: Evgeni Malkin, Noah Welch

Guys to trade/demote/waive/release/let go: Eric Boguneicki, Cory Cross, Shane Endicott, Ric Jackman, Konstantin Koltsov, John LeClair, Josef Melichar, Lyle Odelein, Jani Rita, Ryan Vanden Bussche

Depth guys who could go either way: Eric Cairns, Matt Murley, Rob Scuderi

---

I really feel that if the Pens can add a couple solid defensive defensemen and a top two line forward along with Malkin, they could see quite a bit of improvement next season. The team as it is right now is a mess; it really is no wonder why they've lost 16 of 17 games. That doesn't mean they're going to be this putrid next season. Most of the team is made up of young players with little experience. Almost half the team is made up of fringe guys who shouldn't be back next season. Malkin's going to be a significant addition. Two or three other additions and improvement from the youngsters and this team will challenge for a bottom playoff seed next year.
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Postby Pipes Hochuli on Tue Feb 07, 2006 9:11 pm

just out of curiousity, does anyone know of a potential list of free agents available in the offseason, or off of the top of their heads know anyone that might've signed similar 1 year deals like leclair with other clubs?
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