Palffy: return 50-50, considers coming back to Pittsburgh

[DayWalker]

Despite his injury history, I actually liked the Palffy signing last summer. Given the money given out to statistically less productive players after the lockout, Palffy looked like a decent investment. However, like many others on the team, he turned out to be a terrible disappointment, and it is quite fortunate if his contract is now "off the books."

While he may be able to come back, be productive again (a pretty safe bet, IMO), and be a "good citizen," I am not sure I would take the chance of being stuck with his contract if he continues to chafe at playing for a non-playoff team (if that is in fact what happened.)

[Brode]

NHL contracts are guaranteed against playing injuries. That is a fact, not my opinion.

I'm not too sure about that. Didn't Malakhov retire due to a playing injury?

He filed retirement papers with the NHL that had nothing to do with an injury. Again another fact.

For one, there's no jury to impress, so you don't have to act like a dick to me about this. Just talk like people. If he simply filed retirement papers, maybe you can explain to me why guys in retirement limbo like Malakhov and Mogilny are killing New Jersey. Because as far as I had been explained, the rule was stated so teams wouldn't go after 40 year olds with 5 year contracts.

A corpse could score 30 goals riding shotgun with Crosby

And Palffy couldn't. I can't believe that a guy like Palffy didn't score goals because he didn't want to. No matter how much I hear about how Palffy has no heart, it cannot convince me that his ennui built to the level that it made Palffy hate scoring goals. This is a guy who kissed a guy after scoring a goal. The fact that he couldn't indicates something is physically wrong with him. Don't treat every Slav like they're Jagr and they have the ability to just shut down if someone makes fun of their hair.

also have enough heart to not let Hatcher cross check him in the face or Kovalchuk slew foot him into the boards.

Well now you're just riding Palffy for no reason. Do you actually believe it's Palffy's responsibility to go after thugs that pick on Crosby? We didn't sign him to protect Crosby. Has Palffy ever been in a scrap? You're dressing down a player for lacking skills that he has no business having. If Palffy was Jarome Iginla, I doubt he would've been signed for 4.5 million. Maybe you should ride CP for bringing in a fighter who gets his jaw broken in practically his first fight.

The Pens wouldn't get to have Palffy practice with the NHL team to determine whether or not they wanted to "activate" him.

I never said he would. In fact, I would doubt he would cross the Atlantic unless he had a job. That doesn't mean we aren't going to see what he skates like, see if he can skate. See if he can shoot, more importantly.

If the Pens don't reinstate Palffy's contract he would be free to sign with any NHL team. He doesn't need relief from an amended CBA.

I think you misunderstood what I said in that last paragraph.

[shawnlesky]

Put anyone on Crosby's wing short of Rico Fata and they are 30 goal man for a heck of alot less than Palffy.

Why do you assume he'll cost what he did? He can likely be signed to an incentive-laden one-year deal.

Remember, he won't have the same three year deal he had; that's been nullified.

[Draftnik]

NHL contracts are guaranteed against playing injuries. That is a fact, not my opinion.

I'm not too sure about that. Didn't Malakhov retire due to a playing injury?

He filed retirement papers with the NHL that had nothing to do with an injury. Again another fact.

For one, there's no jury to impress, so you don't have to act like a dick to me about this. Just talk like people. If he simply filed retirement papers, maybe you can explain to me why guys in retirement limbo like Malakhov and Mogilny are killing New Jersey. Because as far as I had been explained, the rule was stated so teams wouldn't go after 40 year olds with 5 year contracts.

A corpse could score 30 goals riding shotgun with Crosby

And Palffy couldn't. I can't believe that a guy like Palffy didn't score goals because he didn't want to. No matter how much I hear about how Palffy has no heart, it cannot convince me that his ennui built to the level that it made Palffy hate scoring goals. This is a guy who kissed a guy after scoring a goal. The fact that he couldn't indicates something is physically wrong with him. Don't treat every Slav like they're Jagr and they have the ability to just shut down if someone makes fun of their hair.

also have enough heart to not let Hatcher cross check him in the face or Kovalchuk slew foot him into the boards.

Well now you're just riding Palffy for no reason. Do you actually believe it's Palffy's responsibility to go after thugs that pick on Crosby? We didn't sign him to protect Crosby. Has Palffy ever been in a scrap? You're dressing down a player for lacking skills that he has no business having. If Palffy was Jarome Iginla, I doubt he would've been signed for 4.5 million. Maybe you should ride CP for bringing in a fighter who gets his jaw broken in practically his first fight.

The Pens wouldn't get to have Palffy practice with the NHL team to determine whether or not they wanted to "activate" him.

I never said he would. In fact, I would doubt he would cross the Atlantic unless he had a job. That doesn't mean we aren't going to see what he skates like, see if he can skate. See if he can shoot, more importantly.

If the Pens don't reinstate Palffy's contract he would be free to sign with any NHL team. He doesn't need relief from an amended CBA.

I think you misunderstood what I said in that last paragraph.

NHL contracts are guaranteed against injury. That is a fact, not my opinion. Injured players were even paid their full contacts during the lockout, again a fact, not my opinion.

The reason Mogilny and Malakhov are killing NJ is the new CBA has a rule that any player that signs at 35+ will have the full value of his contract counted for Cap purposes no matter when they retire. It was implemented to prevent the NYR for example from giving Brendan Shanahan a 5 year $20M deal with $7M salaries in the 1st 2 years and $3M salaries in the last 3 years then having Shanny retire after 2 years. In that scenario he would have been a $7M player with a $4M Cap charge. None of that applies to Palffy and I have no idea why you are injecting Mogilny/Malakhov into this discussion because they have nothing to do with it.

Jagr is a Czech, not a Slav. Jagr was also one of the Pens all time great warriors. His 1999 game 6 performance versus the NJD was one of the most courageous performances in NHL history. Even in 01 his 3 assists won game 7 versus the Sabres. His Pens career was chalked full of great clutch performances, 5 Art Ross trophies, a Hart Trophy, and 2 Stanley Cups. To sully the great Jagr by mentioning his name in the same context with a loser like Palffy is blasphemy.

Opponents took liberties with Crosby all season. That is a fact, not my opinion. He doesn't need Dave Semenko to ride shotgun for him, just a couple of teammates that care enough to step up and return cheapshots in kind. When he has cowardly ice capades like Palffy on his wing that is an invitation for abuse.

If you think watching Palffy skate and shoot in some practice scenario in Europe would indicate he is worth paying $4.5M in 07/08 especially in light of the fact he would be 35 and not played a full NHL season in 4 years then we obviously agree to disagree.

[Draftnik]

Put anyone on Crosby's wing short of Rico Fata and they are 30 goal man for a heck of alot less than Palffy.

Why do you assume he'll cost what he did? He can likely be signed to an incentive-laden one-year deal.

Remember, he won't have the same three year deal he had; that's been nullified.

The Pens would retain his rights under his previous deal. They wouldn't have carte blanche to sign him to any deal of their liking. If they didn't reinstate his previous deal he likely would be an UFA. He is 34 years old, the Pens would not retain his exclusive rights unless they had him signed to a contract.

[Brode]

None of that applies to Palffy and I have no idea why you are injecting Mogilny/Malakhov into this discussion because they have nothing to do with it.

Because I was confused about the situation, and if you didn't come in here guns blazing, it might have been explained without the grandstanding and the penis-waving.

Jagr is a Czech, not a Slav.

Actually, he is a Slav. He's not a Slovak. But he is a Slav. I'm referring to the region (since I wasn't sure of Palffy's nationality and unwilling to look them up), not the exact country. Czechs and Slovaks are Slavs, much like how Finns and Swedes are Scandanavians.

Opponents took liberties with Crosby all season. That is a fact, not my opinion.

Okay, for one. Stop saying 'that is a fact, not my opinion'. Who are you showing off to with that? For two, who ever denied that Crosby was taken advantage of? I applauded Shero's moves to bring in guys like Ruutu and Petro. Last year I thought it was good we had Roy, but then he broke his jaw and became a 'skill player' for the rest of the season. But to honestly believe that Palffy should be responsible for taking down Derian Hatcher after he rearranges Sid's teeth is just ... it's... it's incredibly disingenuous.

If you think watching Palffy skate and shoot in some practice scenario in Europe would indicate he is worth paying $4.5M in 07/08 especially in light of the fact he would be 35 and not played a full NHL season in 4 years then we obviously agree to disagree.

Seeing a guy practice is no way to determine if he's capable of playing? Especially a guy who has proven he can play at a high level? Do you think Philadelphia is going to require Primeau to play with the Phantoms as proof that he can still play? No. They're going to watch him do drills, skate, shoot, do several scrums. And then they'll make the call. Practices count, not just games. That's why training camp comes before pre-season.

[Draftnik]

None of that applies to Palffy and I have no idea why you are injecting Mogilny/Malakhov into this discussion because they have nothing to do with it.

Because I was confused about the situation, and if you didn't come in here guns blazing, it might have been explained without the grandstanding and the penis-waving.

Jagr is a Czech, not a Slav.

Actually, he is a Slav. He's not a Slovak. But he is a Slav. I'm referring to the region (since I wasn't sure of Palffy's nationality and unwilling to look them up), not the exact country. Czechs and Slovaks are Slavs, much like how Finns and Swedes are Scandanavians.

Opponents took liberties with Crosby all season. That is a fact, not my opinion.

Okay, for one. Stop saying 'that is a fact, not my opinion'. Who are you showing off to with that? For two, who ever denied that Crosby was taken advantage of? I applauded Shero's moves to bring in guys like Ruutu and Petro. Last year I thought it was good we had Roy, but then he broke his jaw and became a 'skill player' for the rest of the season. But to honestly believe that Palffy should be responsible for taking down Derian Hatcher after he rearranges Sid's teeth is just ... it's... it's incredibly disingenuous.

If you think watching Palffy skate and shoot in some practice scenario in Europe would indicate he is worth paying $4.5M in 07/08 especially in light of the fact he would be 35 and not played a full NHL season in 4 years then we obviously agree to disagree.

Seeing a guy practice is no way to determine if he's capable of playing? Especially a guy who has proven he can play at a high level? Do you think Philadelphia is going to require Primeau to play with the Phantoms as proof that he can still play? No. They're going to watch him do drills, skate, shoot, do several scrums. And then they'll make the call. Practices count, not just games. That's why training camp comes before pre-season.

You are confused. That explains everything. Philadelphia (or their insurance carrier) is going to pay Keith Primeau whether or not he practices or plays. His situation is in no way similar to the Pens situation with Palffy because Primeau is legitimately injured and has gone through the conventional NHL injury protocol.

[shawnlesky]

Put anyone on Crosby's wing short of Rico Fata and they are 30 goal man for a heck of alot less than Palffy.

Why do you assume he'll cost what he did? He can likely be signed to an incentive-laden one-year deal.

Remember, he won't have the same three year deal he had; that's been nullified.

The Pens would retain his rights under his previous deal. They wouldn't have carte blanche to sign him to any deal of their liking. If they didn't reinstate his previous deal he likely would be an UFA. He is 34 years old, the Pens would not retain his exclusive rights unless they had him signed to a contract.

I disagree. The Penguins would have all the leverage without question as they could block his entry into the NHL until a later date if he didn't agree to their terms.

There's no way they'd reinstate his former contract; never, unless Shero is a complete idiot. They can negotiate a one year deal full of incentives and then he'd be a UFA after its conclusion.

They could also trade his rights.

The big thing is that they hold his rights and he can't enter the NHL but through them. Of course, he could wait longer and it'd be out of their hands, but he's stuck for the time being, and it's very much their ballgame.

[Brode]

You're twisting the argument. You said that we wouldn't be able to tell if Palffy is capable of playing by watching him practice. I obviously disagree, as that's how the Flyers will tell if Primeau is capable of playing. It has absolutely nothing to do with contracts or who is paying them. You're changing the argument.

[Draftnik]

I disagree. The Penguins would have all the leverage without question as they could block his entry into the NHL until a later date if he didn't agree to their terms.

There's no way they'd reinstate his former contract; never, unless Shero is a complete idiot. They can negotiate a one year deal full of incentives and then he'd be a UFA after its conclusion.

They could also trade his rights.

The big thing is that they hold his rights and he can't enter the NHL but through them. Of course, he could wait longer and it'd be out of their hands, but he's stuck for the time being, and it's very much their ballgame.

How would they hold his rights without a contract? Look at it this way, the only way NHL teams hold the rights to players (under the UFA age) is to qualify them based on their previous contract. The player doesn't have to agree to the contract, but his NHL rights are retained by the team. I guess theoretically under that scenario the Pens might be able to retain Palffy by offering him a prorated $4.5M deal (100% qualifier based on more than average NHL salary) for a partial 06/07 season, but it makes no sense to think the Pens could arbitrarily hold Palffy's rights and be able to offer the compensation of their choice at the same time. The NHLPA would never agree to such restrictive terms.

[Draftnik]

You're twisting the argument. You said that we wouldn't be able to tell if Palffy is capable of playing by watching him practice. I obviously disagree, as that's how the Flyers will tell if Primeau is capable of playing. It has absolutely nothing to do with contracts or who is paying them. You're changing the argument.

Actually it has everything to do with contracts and who is paying them. Primeau will get paid regardless of whether or not he plays. That is because he went on IR with a legitimate injury, unlike Palffy. He also will practice with the Flyers against other NHL players if he tries to come back before the Flyers decide on activating him because he has a valid NHL contract. The Flyers, Primeau and the insurance company could probably work out some kind of trial period as Brian Berard worked out with the company that held his permanent disability policy when he originally came back from his eye injury.

Palffy on the other hand can't practice with the Pens or any other team unless he is under contract. The Pens would have to determine if they wanted to pay him based on skating and shooting, not a full contract NHL practice. There is a big difference since the Pens would be assuming significant payroll, even if it is pro-rated and it may very well be for a full season in 07/08.

I'm not surprised you don't understand the distinction from the Primeau situation. Stop injecting nonsense about Primeau, Mogilny, and Malakhov into an already nonsensical situation.

[sanscrit]

Sign him to a low-ball 1-year deal with the promise of trading him to Minnesota. He would take anything for the chance to play with Gaborik and Demitra. Getting something for him is better than nothing. Maybe a mid-low draft pick?

[bh]

You're twisting the argument. You said that we wouldn't be able to tell if Palffy is capable of playing by watching him practice. I obviously disagree, as that's how the Flyers will tell if Primeau is capable of playing. It has absolutely nothing to do with contracts or who is paying them. You're changing the argument.

Actually it has everything to do with contracts and who is paying them. Primeau will get paid regardless of whether or not he plays. That is because he went on IR with a legitimate injury, unlike Palffy. He also will practice with the Flyers against other NHL players if he tries to come back before the Flyers decide on activating him because he has a valid NHL contract. The Flyers, Primeau and the insurance company could probably work out some kind of trial period as Brian Berard worked out with the company that held his permanent disability policy when he originally came back from his eye injury.

Palffy on the other hand can't practice with the Pens or any other team unless he is under contract. The Pens would have to determine if they wanted to pay him based on skating and shooting, not a full contract NHL practice. There is a big difference since the Pens would be assuming significant payroll, even if it is pro-rated and it may very well be for a full season in 07/08.

I'm not surprised you don't understand the distinction from the Primeau situation. Stop injecting nonsense about Primeau, Mogilny, and Malakhov into an already nonsensical situation.

Dudes or Dudettes, you both are talking two different languages here. You are both making points that are going over the other persons head. Drafty, all Brode is saying here is that by watching a player practice you can tell if he's "healthy" which is why he refers to Primeau. He is not talking about Primeau's contract or saying that Palffy is in the same boat as Primeau other than the "fact" that they are comming off injuries. You are being awfully rude in a situation where you don't have to be and in many instances above you are changing the argument.

[Draftnik]

Dudes or Dudettes, you both are talking two different languages here. You are both making points that are going over the other persons head. Drafty, all Brode is saying here is that by watching a player practice you can tell if he's "healthy" which is why he refers to Primeau. He is not talking about Primeau's contract or saying that Palffy is in the same boat as Primeau other than the "fact" that they are comming off injuries. You are being awfully rude in a situation where you don't have to be and in many instances above you are changing the argument.

We obviously agree to disagree. Palffy's situation is entirely different than any injured player with an existing NHL contract because those players can actually practice in the sense of scrimmaging, taking and giving hits, etc. All the Pens could watch little Palffy do is shoot some pucks in an empty rink. That is nothing like an NHL practice.


What is the risk the Flyers have with Primeau? First off, his "practice" will be a full contract NHL practice. Palffy can't do that. Primeau can take and receive hits. Palffy can't do that in the NHL without a contract. Second, the Flyers or their insurance company are already paying Primeau because he is legitimately injured. The Pens are not already paying Palffy. Theoretically the Flyers risk keeping Primeau's $3M+ salary open against their Cap so maybe they can't sign a guy like Anson Carter. If Primeau plays and gets hurt they may have to absorb 35 games of salary before his already insured provision kicks in. No sweat for a team that had a payroll north of $50M a few years ago. He would go back on the long term injury list and the Flyers would get their $3M Cap space back.

The Pens would have to pay Palffy nearly $2M for a partial season when they got comparable production with Crosby for 10% of the cost with a street free agent like Hilbert. Would the Pens even be able to insure Palffy? Would they be able to qualify him on his previous salary or would they have to take him back with the 07/08 year intact and another $4.5M liability on the books. There is huge risk for the Pens to add $2M to their losses when they can get comparable production for 10% of the cost. There is huge financial risk with little upside for the Pens in signing a 34 year old soft injury prone guy Palffy. Furthermore the little coward never even had an MRI or other conventional examination like an exit physical when he quit. The Pens wouldn't be able to medically compare his allegedly injured shoulder to the condition it was in when he retired. They also wouldn't be able to see him give or take a hit with his allegedly injured shoulder. It makes no sense to risk a few million dollars without seeing him in contact situations.

Palffy quitting and erasing the Pens $9M liability from their books was one of the best things to happen to them last season. There is no reason for a reprise of that mistake. Shero will do a cost/benefit analysis on Palffy, not just add him to the roster in some PlayStation scenario.

[KG]

I am sure it's total bs. But a blogger has a bit on palffy today.

http://brochuishockey.blogspot.com/

Ziggy Palffy is working out regularly and hoping to return to the NHL. Pittsburgh owns his rights, but he won't be ready until January.

Something to talk about...

[Jim]

Well, if we have injuries and are in a decent spot in the standings... play him. Otherwise move him. At that point in the year I am sure you could get decent return for an offensive forward like that. We could move him for a prospect, or replace the draft picks that Shero moved this summer. THat would basically make all the pickups this summer free, lol.

[conforto45]

just adds to a team that could be ready to explode on offense. dont know where you could put him.. if he would be willing to accept a lower lined role, then bring the guy back

[KG]

If he does come back, they could always deal Recchi again to make room for him

Seriously, if he comes back. Making room for Palffy would be the least of their problems...

[owtahear]

just adds to a team that could be ready to explode on offense. dont know where you could put him.. if he would be willing to accept a lower lined role, then bring the guy back

HUH??? This makes no sense. You either bring Ziggy back for a wing on one of the top 2 lines (aka Crosby and Malkin) or not at all. You don't bring him back as a checking line player, that would be stupid.

[Tomas]

I am sure it's total bs. But a blogger has a bit on palffy today.

http://brochuishockey.blogspot.com/

Ziggy Palffy is working out regularly and hoping to return to the NHL. Pittsburgh owns his rights, but he won't be ready until January.

Something to talk about...

Well, there is nothing about that in any Slovak media I know. Definitely nothing on the main hockey server hokej.sk

The only two new articles (from a popular Slovak tabloid):

1. Palffy's horse Charriot is about to run in his first race (Sept. 10) Palfy admitted that he did not like that horse at first, because the horse looked "hairy and small."
http://www.bleskovky.sk/cl/12/124385/Pa ... ta-osedlal
2. His wife is pregnant
http://www.bleskovky.sk/cl/15/121665/An ... i-Tehotna-

[Jim]

The two player trade Shero made so far were:

Ekman and Ehelechner from San Jose for a second-round pick

Moore and Pivko From Nashville for a third-round pick

If Palffy would come back I could see a playoff bound team that is shy on offense (or injury ridden) going for him. They said something about January at the earliest, so while that is not the trade deadline time... it's late enough for teams to know what they need. Depending on need I could see Shero getting a #2 and #3 for him. Maybe a #2 and a conditional #3 (Palffy finishes the season), something like that.

[Jim]

I actually just cracked myself up...

Pallfy -for- Ehelechner, Ekman, Moore and Pivko

Tell me that doesn't almost look like a CP salary dump trade.... HA!

[saleen66]

I actually just cracked myself up...

Pallfy -for- Ehelechner, Ekman, Moore and Pivko

Tell me that doesn't almost look like a CP salary dump trade.... HA!

LOL Yup

[The Snapshot]

[
2. His wife is pregnant
http://www.bleskovky.sk/cl/15/121665/An ... i-Tehotna-

That explains everything. Ziggy just needs to get out of the house.

[NJ5934]

Well, if we have injuries and are in a decent spot in the standings... play him. Otherwise move him. At that point in the year I am sure you could get decent return for an offensive forward like that. We could move him for a prospect, or replace the draft picks that Shero moved this summer. THat would basically make all the pickups this summer free, lol.

If Ekman cost us a second rounder in the offseason, I would hope Palffy would get us at least that in return half way through the season. If not I'd be happy with a prospect winger or two.