Gonchar Down

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Re: Gonchar Down

Postby Kovy27 on Sun Sep 21, 2008 11:35 am

Sign Schneider?! Get the hell out of here. He sucks more than Melichar.
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Re: Gonchar Down

Postby netwolf on Sun Sep 21, 2008 11:37 am

He was hurting. His left arm was just hanging. I'll be surprised if it's not separated.
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Re: Gonchar Down

Postby bhaw on Sun Sep 21, 2008 11:40 am

SolidSnake wrote:
mikey287 wrote:You guys all realize that instead of grabbing Schneider's ridiculous salary we could just sign Bryan Berard to be a power play specialist for like $8 and a pack of gum...

If (note the "if") we need some offensive help on the blueline for a little bit, it can be had without breaking the bank...easily...relax... 8-)



I thought he signed with Philly?


mikey just likes to make stuff up and post it to get hits :P :lol:

I believe Berard is just on a try out tho.
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Re: Gonchar Down

Postby bhaw on Sun Sep 21, 2008 11:40 am

netwolf wrote:He was hurting. His left arm was just hanging. I'll be surprised if it's not separated.



doh... ok. I was going off what others had said. That sucks then.
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Re: Gonchar Down

Postby demangone on Sun Sep 21, 2008 12:00 pm

I think Gonchar just gets down on himself and gets frustrated a lot. It's probably (hopefully) less serious than it looked. SCF game 5, he was in street clothes and had his bags packed. I remember at the end of the 05-06 season where he mailed in the end of the season. He's durable and he'll be back soon.
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Re: Gonchar Down

Postby SolidSnake on Sun Sep 21, 2008 12:22 pm

bhaw wrote:
SolidSnake wrote:
mikey287 wrote:You guys all realize that instead of grabbing Schneider's ridiculous salary we could just sign Bryan Berard to be a power play specialist for like $8 and a pack of gum...

If (note the "if") we need some offensive help on the blueline for a little bit, it can be had without breaking the bank...easily...relax... 8-)



I thought he signed with Philly?


mikey just likes to make stuff up and post it to get hits :P :lol:

I believe Berard is just on a try out tho.



Ah I see. Who knows he still may be available.
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Re: Gonchar Down

Postby Pitts on Sun Sep 21, 2008 12:30 pm

Bob McKenzie wrote:You guys are right. If we plucked Schneider off on waivers, we're responsible for his insane salary. If we plucked him off of re-entry waivers, we're responsible for half of it (while Anaheim is responsible for the other half). That said, Amaheim is screwed unless they can dump him to LA.

Anaheim has no intentions of putting him on re-entry waivers. They already have up to 5 teams offering deals for him. He will be moved within the next few days.
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Re: Gonchar Down

Postby Bob McKenzie on Sun Sep 21, 2008 12:52 pm

Kovy27 wrote:Sign Schneider?! Get the hell out of here. He sucks more than Melichar.


You're being a little too over dramatic.

According to Ducks fans, Schneider was really good but Pronger and Neidermayer are better than him and they have defensive depth. If it's coming down to having Selanne or Schneider on your team, I think 100% of us would go with Selanne...especially when you have Pronger/Neidermayer and the ching tied up in them.

Melichar? lol...
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Re: Gonchar Down

Postby mikey287 on Sun Sep 21, 2008 1:04 pm

Just because Berard is on tryout does not mean he can't be signed to an actual contract...(at least, that's the impression I'm under)

Secondly, it doesn't have to be just Bryan Berard...offensive d-men are a dime-a-dozen...we could try to bring back Lupaschuk!
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Re: Gonchar Down

Postby Henry Hank on Sun Sep 21, 2008 1:32 pm

Gonchar's getting hurt was the only meaningful negative outcome of the game. Hope it's not too serious... this is why they didn't trade Sydor months ago. With injuries mounting, they may very well be forced to use him.

Gonchar being out would suck, but not the end of the world because it's an opportunity for Goligoski. At this rate he may never see the AHL again.
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Re: Gonchar Down

Postby penny lane on Sun Sep 21, 2008 1:47 pm

I am sending healing vibes to Segei. He is the glue to the PP and his loss would have a trickle down effect to the rest of the defense. Not fair to leave the season with shoulder/ neck problem and to return with shoulder injury.
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Re: Gonchar Down

Postby Eismann on Sun Sep 21, 2008 3:17 pm

penny lane wrote:I am sending healing vibes to Segei. He is the glue to the PP and his loss would have a trickle down effect to the rest of the defense. Not fair to leave the season with shoulder/ neck problem and to return with shoulder injury.


By no means am I happy that Sarge was out, but a silver lining of it, at least as far as the PP goes, is that he's not there to carry the puck up; or, in Pens vernacular, to carry the puck up, dump in, then chase the clear-out. Sid and Geno did a lot of the carrying, with much crisper passes to wingers who simply stepped over the blue, then used their sense to either penetrate or dish. The result was more time in the attack zone.
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Re: Gonchar Down

Postby penny lane on Sun Sep 21, 2008 3:33 pm

Eismann wrote:
penny lane wrote:I am sending healing vibes to Segei. He is the glue to the PP and his loss would have a trickle down effect to the rest of the defense. Not fair to leave the season with shoulder/ neck problem and to return with shoulder injury.


By no means am I happy that Sarge was out, but a silver lining of it, at least as far as the PP goes, is that he's not there to carry the puck up; or, in Pens vernacular, to carry the puck up, dump in, then chase the clear-out. Sid and Geno did a lot of the carrying, with much crisper passes to wingers who simply stepped over the blue, then used their sense to either penetrate or dish. The result was more time in the attack zone.


I heard the pens even had an all forward PP last night. :shock: High rewards with risk involved.
But, this does get Sykora on the 1st PP unit, where he belongs.
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Re: Gonchar Down

Postby shmenguin on Sun Sep 21, 2008 3:35 pm

penny lane wrote:
Eismann wrote:
penny lane wrote:I am sending healing vibes to Segei. He is the glue to the PP and his loss would have a trickle down effect to the rest of the defense. Not fair to leave the season with shoulder/ neck problem and to return with shoulder injury.


By no means am I happy that Sarge was out, but a silver lining of it, at least as far as the PP goes, is that he's not there to carry the puck up; or, in Pens vernacular, to carry the puck up, dump in, then chase the clear-out. Sid and Geno did a lot of the carrying, with much crisper passes to wingers who simply stepped over the blue, then used their sense to either penetrate or dish. The result was more time in the attack zone.


I heard the pens even had an all forward PP last night. :shock: High rewards with risk involved.
But, this does get Sykora on the 1st PP unit, where he belongs.


i've wanted to see sid on the point for a while. i doubt a 5 FWD pp would ever happen during a real game, but i like that sid is an option in that spot on some level.
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Re: Gonchar Down

Postby Sigwolf on Sun Sep 21, 2008 3:47 pm

Pitts wrote:
Bob McKenzie wrote:You guys are right. If we plucked Schneider off on waivers, we're responsible for his insane salary. If we plucked him off of re-entry waivers, we're responsible for half of it (while Anaheim is responsible for the other half). That said, Amaheim is screwed unless they can dump him to LA.

Anaheim has no intentions of putting him on re-entry waivers. They already have up to 5 teams offering deals for him. He will be moved within the next few days.



If Anaheim had that many teams interested in Schneider at full price, I don't think they would have had to get to the point of putting him on waivers in the first place. They knew they have to clear salary, and obviously no one was biting. Not to mention the fact that if no one claimed him off waivers, when the could have had him for no more than his salary, why would 5 teams suddenly be interested in giving something up as well as taking on the same salary?

That said, I think people are also undervaluing the potential loss of Gonchar for an extended period. Based on his prior history, a powerplay quarterback would be the top priority to fill in for him. Last year for the Penguins he provided a heck of a lot more than that, as he was their best defenseman on the ice, not just an offensive threat...
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Re: Gonchar Down

Postby ivand87 on Sun Sep 21, 2008 4:28 pm

Gonchar to be limited for 3-4 weeks? Inside Access

Sunday, September 21st, 2008 by Inside Pittsburgh Sports News Wire <--- LOL

How long will the Penguins #1 defenseman be out. DePaoli reports on the latest buzz surrounding Sergei Gonchar.


Wow that idiot charges people for news now. Unreal. What's the latest on Gonchar?
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Re: Gonchar Down

Postby Pitts on Sun Sep 21, 2008 4:30 pm

Sigwolf wrote:If Anaheim had that many teams interested in Schneider at full price, I don't think they would have had to get to the point of putting him on waivers in the first place. They knew they have to clear salary, and obviously no one was biting. Not to mention the fact that if no one claimed him off waivers, when the could have had him for no more than his salary, why would 5 teams suddenly be interested in giving something up as well as taking on the same salary

I'm only quoting what has been noted in the press. The issue is not that team are not interested in Schneider at the cost of his salary, it is that Burke wants to dump him for nothing. Since no one wanted to simply take the salary off Burke's hands, he is now forced to listen to, and most likely accept, an offer he would dismiss earlier. If he puts him on re-entry waivers, he is still responsible for half his salary.

Now, he will either have to take some salary back, or give up a high round (1st or 2nd) along with Schneider. He himself said he didn't move him before because that is what teams wanted. He is at the point now where his hands are tied and he simply has to agree to the most palatable deal he can get.
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Re: Gonchar Down

Postby Sigwolf on Sun Sep 21, 2008 11:04 pm

Pitts wrote:
Sigwolf wrote:If Anaheim had that many teams interested in Schneider at full price, I don't think they would have had to get to the point of putting him on waivers in the first place. They knew they have to clear salary, and obviously no one was biting. Not to mention the fact that if no one claimed him off waivers, when the could have had him for no more than his salary, why would 5 teams suddenly be interested in giving something up as well as taking on the same salary

I'm only quoting what has been noted in the press. The issue is not that team are not interested in Schneider at the cost of his salary, it is that Burke wants to dump him for nothing. Since no one wanted to simply take the salary off Burke's hands, he is now forced to listen to, and most likely accept, an offer he would dismiss earlier. If he puts him on re-entry waivers, he is still responsible for half his salary.

Now, he will either have to take some salary back, or give up a high round (1st or 2nd) along with Schneider. He himself said he didn't move him before because that is what teams wanted. He is at the point now where his hands are tied and he simply has to agree to the most palatable deal he can get.



Again, doesn't make sense. You can quote whatever you want that has been 'noted' in the press. The press often 'notes' complete nonsense. Anaheim wants to dump him, but they are not interested in takin half of his 5.75m salary, but they are suddenly interested in taking an unwanted player from another team whose salary must obviously be less than 2.8m? Anaheim's goal is obviously to shed salary from the bottom line, so how does taking any of that 2.8m back benefit them?

Put it this way... Anaheims goal is to shed salary. If they put him on re-entry waivers, they take 2.8m in cap hit, and accordingly save 2.8m. Every team dealing with them knows this. If they take salary back, it has to be someone making less than 2.8 to make any impact at all, and players making that little are not frequently viewed as hard to unload and/or necessary pieces of a trade. Accordingly, any team that could have taken off waivers isn't suddenly going to be interested in aquiring him in a trade for a league minimum player... they are going to want to shed more to pick up that salary, which is counter to what Anaheim wants.

Anaheim tried to trade him before they resorted to waivers... didn't work. It's more than a little hard to believe they suddenly have 5 suitors after the fact. I have no problem believing 5 teams are interested in him on re-entry, and I suspect that is how he will go. Anaheim stood to gain 2.8m in cap space over the waiver option if they had been able to trade him, but that space likely dwindles to 1.5m or less by taking a player in return. Is it worth it for that gain? They surely could make it happen by offering a 1st or 2nd round pick, but again, is it worth saving the slight cap savings versus re-entry waivers in the long run if you are also losing an early round pick?
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Re: Gonchar Down

Postby Pitts on Mon Sep 22, 2008 12:04 am

Sig, Burke was already quoted stating he will not put him on re-entry waivers. You are basically stating similar points that I made. Yes, Anaheim wants to shed the salary, but is having a hard time. Some teams do not have to shed salary to take on Schneider -- hence the constant LA rumors. They aren't even at the floor yet. As for your last sentence, Anaheim needs to avoid even the $2.8 hit to be able to afford Selanne who is looking at about $4 mil to play. It will HAVE to be worth it for Burke to move a high round pick with Schneider for a few prospects, bottom salary guys to lose the cap hit. He has no other option. No GM out there is going to do Burke any favors - hey will take him for what they can.
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Re: Gonchar Down

Postby André on Mon Sep 22, 2008 2:31 am

Pitts wrote:Sig, Burke was already quoted stating he will not put him on re-entry waivers. You are basically stating similar points that I made. Yes, Anaheim wants to shed the salary, but is having a hard time. Some teams do not have to shed salary to take on Schneider -- hence the constant LA rumors. They aren't even at the floor yet. As for your last sentence, Anaheim needs to avoid even the $2.8 hit to be able to afford Selanne who is looking at about $4 mil to play. It will HAVE to be worth it for Burke to move a high round pick with Schneider for a few prospects, bottom salary guys to lose the cap hit. He has no other option. No GM out there is going to do Burke any favors - hey will take him for what they can.


I didn't think you made sense either at first but yeah sending someone back rather than just getting a new guy and his salary could actually be better now with the cap system.
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Re: Gonchar Down

Postby PensFanBryan on Mon Sep 22, 2008 9:09 am

netwolf wrote:He was hurting. His left arm was just hanging. I'll be surprised if it's not separated.



I think they were alittle worried, and kept him out of the game for precaution. I saw him hanging his arm, but he did move the hand on that arm, to tell the guy in the runway to open the door. So, im hoping it wasnt too bad.
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Re: Gonchar Down

Postby Pitts on Mon Sep 22, 2008 9:47 am

André wrote:I didn't think you made sense either at first but yeah sending someone back rather than just getting a new guy and his salary could actually be better now with the cap system.

There's no sense to be made. It is quite simple actually:

Burke said he tried to trade him before putting him on waivers, but didn't like the offers he got (he either had to take back some salary, or add in a nice pick). So, he waived him hoping a team would just take him and his salary off his hands - but nobody was going to do him a favor.
So: He will not put him on re-entry and have to pay half his salary. What's left to do? Go back and accept an offer he doesn't care for -- which would be an expanded package of players and/or picks.

I don't think that is hard to understand.
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Re: Gonchar Down

Postby KG on Mon Sep 22, 2008 9:52 am

No worries guys. Sydor said he used to run the powerplay in Dallas. So we are all good!
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Re: Gonchar Down

Postby penny lane on Mon Sep 22, 2008 10:24 am

KG wrote:No worries guys. Sydor said he used to run the powerplay in Dallas. So we are all good!



I like Sydor and fortunately he wasn't a part of a hasty trade in the summer.
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Re: Gonchar Down

Postby bhaw on Mon Sep 22, 2008 10:26 am

has there been any update on Gonchar yet?
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