Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

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Re: Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

Postby PensFanInDC on Thu Jan 08, 2009 6:38 pm

offsides wrote:If true I wonder how long this thread will be?


Just signed on for the first time today....and this made me lol
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Re: Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

Postby offsides on Thu Jan 08, 2009 6:38 pm

offsides wrote:If true I wonder how long this thread will be?


19 pages and counting!!
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Re: Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

Postby columbia on Thu Jan 08, 2009 6:42 pm

The move-by-move analysis of Staal in the GDT should be amusing.
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Re: Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

Postby Gilmore_Tuttle on Thu Jan 08, 2009 6:43 pm

Dave's_a_Killer wrote:
The U wrote:Anyone in favor of this extension better never show their faces in the ACQUIRE A WINGER!!! threads. If you're paying 4 million to a 3rd liner, you can't afford to bring in line 1 wingers. Real line 1 wingers...not Satan-clones. I like Staal but not at 4 mil. I can think of about 15 other 3rd line centers we could sign for about 1 million-2 million who would bring the same stuff as Staal would to the team.

I don't think Staal's speed, hitting, mean streak, play-making, or goal scoring will improve. He's a defensive center right now and I don't see that changing. Those types of guys can be grabbed each and every offseason for a fraction of the cost.


If this turns out to be a good deal, I better not see any of you belly achers in the Jordan Staal is awesome thread.


Your just hoping it turns out good because you have his Jersey!
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Re: Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

Postby wallflower on Thu Jan 08, 2009 7:14 pm

Idoit40fans wrote:
wallflower wrote:This thread = absolute ridiculousness. How sad.


agreed

I would've said that but there was actually some decent/civilized debate until about halfway through the thread. Notice I said it was going to be ridiculous on page one though. ;) :lol:
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Re: Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

Postby Noise on Thu Jan 08, 2009 7:34 pm

LOL Shero just gave Staal a huge vote of confidence and people are talking about trading him still.

He's not going anywhere at the deadline.
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Re: Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

Postby 2headedmonster8771 on Thu Jan 08, 2009 7:40 pm

Well of course people are still talking about trading him...
We just signed ANOTHER center and we still have no help on the wings...
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Re: Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

Postby NJ5934 on Thu Jan 08, 2009 7:51 pm

I just got home and I'm still not sure what I think about this deal. I think it was somewhat inevitable. Realistically I was thinking a 3-3.5 year deal was in order but a half million isn't anything to cry over. It's is a slam dunk for Staal who gets overpaid to some extent and hits UFA at the age of 25 when the contract expires.

I think the only disappointment comes in Orpik and Malkin, who are both overachieving, took less money to stay in Pittsburgh yet Staal, who some would argue is underachieving, maxed out.

Hopefully, Staal feels compelled to earn his raise and makes his spot on Sid's wing a permanent one.
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Re: Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

Postby Pens15 on Thu Jan 08, 2009 7:53 pm

Wow...not to pile on Staal but on FSN they just showed a comparison of Staal to the other guys taken in the top 5 that year...and in like around 150 more games Staal only has 11 more assists than Eric freakin' Johnson. :shock:
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Re: Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

Postby Kicksave on Thu Jan 08, 2009 7:55 pm

Pens15 wrote:Wow...not to pile on Staal but on FSN they just showed a comparison of Staal to the other guys taken in the top 5 that year...and in like around 150 more games Staal only has 11 more assists than Eric freakin' Johnson. :shock:


What about goals?
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Re: Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

Postby NJ5934 on Thu Jan 08, 2009 7:56 pm

Pens15 wrote:Wow...not to pile on Staal but on FSN they just showed a comparison of Staal to the other guys taken in the top 5 that year...and in like around 150 more games Staal only has 11 more assists than Eric freakin' Johnson. :shock:


Tough comparison though. I don't think Johnson and Staal were in the same league. If the Pens had the chance to take Johnson there would not have been any debate. Then again, I don't think Eric Johnson's next contract will be for 4 million a season.
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Re: Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

Postby Pens15 on Thu Jan 08, 2009 8:00 pm

NJ5934 wrote:
Pens15 wrote:Wow...not to pile on Staal but on FSN they just showed a comparison of Staal to the other guys taken in the top 5 that year...and in like around 150 more games Staal only has 11 more assists than Eric freakin' Johnson. :shock:


Tough comparison though. I don't think Johnson and Staal were in the same league. If the Pens had the chance to take Johnson there would not have been any debate. Then again, I don't think Eric Johnson's next contract will be for 4 million a season.


Oh yeah. I just thought it was kind of a striking stat, a center with over 200 games played only has 11 more assists than a defenseman with less than one season. It doesn't really prove anything. Except that Staal hasn't been much of a playmaker in his career.
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Re: Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

Postby joker10277 on Thu Jan 08, 2009 8:10 pm

Shero blew this, heres why:
He had all the leverage in this negotiation and he blew it. RS paid way too much for staal 4mil per for this guy, maybe he gets that somewhere that doesn't have sid and geno but not here. Staal doesn't like your offer, trade him or wait for an offer sheet and take the picks.
He also signed him for 4 years making his next deal when he's eligble as an UFA, hey ray if your gonna overpay how about a 3 year deal so he's a RFA and you have some options? Or how about 5 or 6 years so you take some of his UFA status?? That part is just dumb RS!!

Not to mention you now have 22 Million used up in 3 Centers.

Shero made a bad deal here! I don't care that staal is only 20, that he plays 20 minutes a night. When you have sid and geno as your top 2 centers you don't pay your 3rd line center 4 million.

Staal won't last on sids wing he's too slow, he's a 3rd line center.

I have no confidence in RS, he just keeps making bad deals, even when he had all the leverage in this one.
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Re: Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

Postby Daniel on Thu Jan 08, 2009 8:11 pm

Bob McKenzie wrote:
usahockeyteam1980 wrote:According to TSN, it was worth $16 million over four years:

http://tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=262415&lid= ... Story_main


I have been a supporter of Staal and I'm disappointed he got $4 million. He hasn't earned it yet. I figured in the $3m or $3.5m (tops) range.

If you're paying him that kind of money, forget this 3rd line center crap and put him on Sid's wing (live or die).


I think it is a little high, but that is what the market is for a guy his age with his potential. If RS lets him go to July 1st, I can also guarantee that someone offers him a far greater contract. RS might match, but it will cost the Pens more than $4mil per year.

Atlanta has a huge amount of cap space and could use him. Same with LA and Nashville, just to name a few teams.
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Re: Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

Postby Maestro on Thu Jan 08, 2009 8:29 pm

Staal was Shero's big pick when he came in. Shero loves him. And now it looks like Staal is indeed staying at least into next season, likely longer. This was a "settle down, you're part of our long range plan" signing. I hope it works out. Right now, in terms of their current play on the ice, Dustin Brown and Nathan Horton are a bit ahead of Staal. they're of course older. (Great save fluery)...
Anyway, I guess I don't have to change the letters/#s on my sweater.
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Re: Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

Postby NJ5934 on Thu Jan 08, 2009 8:39 pm

Daniel wrote:
Bob McKenzie wrote:
usahockeyteam1980 wrote:According to TSN, it was worth $16 million over four years:

http://tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=262415&lid= ... Story_main


I have been a supporter of Staal and I'm disappointed he got $4 million. He hasn't earned it yet. I figured in the $3m or $3.5m (tops) range.

If you're paying him that kind of money, forget this 3rd line center crap and put him on Sid's wing (live or die).


I think it is a little high, but that is what the market is for a guy his age with his potential. If RS lets him go to July 1st, I can also guarantee that someone offers him a far greater contract. RS might match, but it will cost the Pens more than $4mil per year. Atlanta has a huge amount of cap space and could use him. Same with LA and Nashville, just to name a few teams.


The market for Crosby and Malkin would have been in the ballpark of 11 million yet they both took 8.7 over long term. I have no doubt 4 million is market value this summer for Staal, but I don't see how four million over four years benefits the Penguins. You have to think Shero intended for him on the top line because nobody can afford to pay their third line center 4 million.

One thing should be clear; Sid, Malkin, Staal, Whitney, Orpik and Fleury better be prepared to do it on their own because there isn't going to be much left over for a supporting cast.
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Re: Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

Postby Daniel on Thu Jan 08, 2009 8:57 pm

NJ5934 wrote:The market for Crosby and Malkin would have been in the ballpark of 11 million yet they both took 8.7 over long term. I have no doubt 4 million is market value this summer for Staal, but I don't see how four million over four years benefits the Penguins. You have to think Shero intended for him on the top line because nobody can afford to pay their third line center 4 million.

One thing should be clear; Sid, Malkin, Staal, Whitney, Orpik and Fleury better be prepared to do it on their own because there isn't going to be much left over for a supporting cast.


I think Staal is a work in progress and I think the plan is for him to be a top 2 line LW.

I think the supporting cast will be fine. Next year, they have 13 players at $41 mill. If the cap stays the same, that leaves $13 mill for 11 players.

Looking at next years lines, assuming all UFA's leave (just throwing names for defense, no real order).

Staal/Crosby/Kennedy
???/Malkin/??? (my guess is that Sykora resigns for about what he makes now)
Cooke/Talbot/Dupuis
Godard/Jeffery/???

Gonchar/Whitney
Orpik/Eaton
Letang/???

With 13 mill left for next year, perhaps they resign Scuderi for a modest raise ($1mill per), that leaves $12 mill. Maybe another $3 for Sykora and that leaves $9 mill for a 4th liner and a LW for Malkin. Of course, that doesn't take into account the cap going up/down.

I don't know what young players are ready to come up, but I am sure some will. Reading what Jesse has to say, it looks like reinforcements will be ready in 2010/11 season, so next year might be a bit rough for depth. However, I think the Pens will be fine.
Last edited by Daniel on Thu Jan 08, 2009 9:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

Postby NeddieVedder on Thu Jan 08, 2009 8:57 pm

joker10277 wrote:I have no confidence in RS, he just keeps making bad deals, even when he had all the leverage in this one.


Name three, and I'll even accept "signed Satan instead of the preferable alternative who doesn't exist" and "Eaton is so overpaid."
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Re: Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

Postby NJ5934 on Thu Jan 08, 2009 9:08 pm

Daniel wrote:Looking at next years lines, assuming all UFA's leave (just throwing names for defense, no real order).

Staal/Crosby/Kennedy
???/Malkin/??? (my guess is that Sykora resigns for about what he makes now)
Cooke/Talbot/Dupuis
Godard/Jeffery/???

Gonchar/Whitney
Orpik/Eaton
Letang/???

With 13 mill left for next year, perhaps they resign Scuderi for a modest raise ($1mill per), that leaves $12 mill. Maybe another $3 for Sykora and that leaves $9 mill for a 4th liner and a LW for Malkin. Of course, that doesn't take into account the cap going up/down.

I don't know what young players are ready to come up, but I am sure some will. Reading what Jesse has to say, it looks like reinforcements will be ready in 2010/11 season, so next year might be a bit rough for depth. However, I think the Pens will be fine.


I think its a bit early to pencil in Staal, Crosby and Kennedy as a 1st line. I think Sykora is due for a raise, whether Shero offers him the 4 million he'll probably get elsewhere remains to be seen. As for Scuderi, did you notice any of the contracts this summer? I would 3-3.5 million a season is more likely than 1. All in all, the major holes remain unchanged, the lack of 1 maybe 2 scoring wingers with even less money to go shopping.
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Re: Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

Postby joker10277 on Thu Jan 08, 2009 9:10 pm

NeddieVedder wrote:
joker10277 wrote:I have no confidence in RS, he just keeps making bad deals, even when he had all the leverage in this one.


Name three, and I'll even accept "signed Satan instead of the preferable alternative who doesn't exist" and "Eaton is so overpaid."


1.signed satan for 3.5 mil
1a. staal for 4 mill/4 years
2. resigned recchi last year and got stuck with half his salary
3. traded a 2nd round pick for nils eckman
Honorable mentions: signed eaton for 2 mill/2years, gave up a 2nd and a 5th for gill

I'll have to do some research for some more that is just off the top of my head.
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Re: Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

Postby Daniel on Thu Jan 08, 2009 9:39 pm

joker10277 wrote:
NeddieVedder wrote:
joker10277 wrote:I have no confidence in RS, he just keeps making bad deals, even when he had all the leverage in this one.


Name three, and I'll even accept "signed Satan instead of the preferable alternative who doesn't exist" and "Eaton is so overpaid."


1.signed satan for 3.5 mil
1a. staal for 4 mill/4 years
2. resigned recchi last year and got stuck with half his salary
3. traded a 2nd round pick for nils eckman
Honorable mentions: signed eaton for 2 mill/2years, gave up a 2nd and a 5th for gill

I'll have to do some research for some more that is just off the top of my head.


Satan was bad.
Staal deal was a good deal, considering what he would have gotten on the open market.
Recchi was a mistake, but he removed the mistake quickly and move on.
You mean the 2 time 20 goal scorer that got hurt? Yea, that was horrible to give up a 2nd round pick for a guy coming off 2 20 goal seasons. :roll:

The Pens went to the Cup finals last year, I am not too concerned with losing a 2nd and a 5th round pick for Gill.

BTW, who did the Pens lose out on with those 2 2nd round picks and the 5th round pick?
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Re: Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

Postby NeddieVedder on Thu Jan 08, 2009 9:58 pm

joker10277 wrote:1.signed satan for 3.5 mil


Should've signed Naslund so we'd have to have the cap hit for more than one year. Or should've signed no winger at all.

1a. staal for 4 mill/4 years


Obviously will turn out terrible.

2. resigned recchi last year and got stuck with half his salary


This was a huge hindrance that prevented us from. uh. Well, Burkle could've bought a car.

3. traded a 2nd round pick for nils eckman


Should've known a 20-goal scorer would be prone to broken elbows.

gave up a 2nd and a 5th for gill


Would much rather have the picks than the Eastern Conference-winning penalty killing.

I'll have to do some research for some more that is just off the top of my head.


This is some research. Shero is killing us. Never should've let Thorburn go either.
Last edited by NeddieVedder on Thu Jan 08, 2009 10:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

Postby Daniel on Thu Jan 08, 2009 10:03 pm

joker10277 wrote:Should've signed Naslund so we'd have to have the cap hit for more than one year. Or should've signed no winger at all.


I would have gone with no winger at all. I personally wouldn't, but it would have been another reason for people to whine. :lol:

Obviously will turn out terrible.


Of course it will. Don't you know Staal has peaked and will never get better? If RS does the opposite, the same people will whine.

This was a huge hindrance that prevented us from. uh. Well, Burkle could've bought a car.


Hey, if RS hadn't have signed Recchi, don't you know the Pens would have won 2 more games in the Cup Finals?

Should've known a 20-goal scorer would be prone to broken elbows.


Everyone else did, how could Shero not have known? At least the whiner group knew.

Would much rather have the picks than the Eastern Conference-winning penalty killing.


C'mon, the penalty kill would have been awesome with a 2nd and 5th round pick.

This is some research. Shero is killing us.


Thing that kills me is this. Everyone expects the Pens to be a better team than they are. This team is struggling right now, but if Shero were as awful as everyone said, why have the high expectations? Wait, I know, because they can't whine.
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Re: Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

Postby Pitts on Thu Jan 08, 2009 11:05 pm

Maestro wrote:Staal was Shero's big pick when he came in. Shero loves him. And now it looks like Staal is indeed staying at least into next season, likely longer. This was a "settle down, you're part of our long range plan" signing. I hope it works out. Right now, in terms of their current play on the ice, Dustin Brown and Nathan Horton are a bit ahead of Staal. they're of course older. (Great save fluery)...
Anyway, I guess I don't have to change the letters/#s on my sweater.

One thing no one seems to think here is that Staal could stay on as center #2 while Malkin (the more expensive and talented of the two) could fetch some very, very nice wingers.
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Re: Pens sign Staal to a 4 year deal!!!

Postby Draftnik on Thu Jan 08, 2009 11:14 pm

Shero is paying for the appreciation Staal will have over the life of the deal. He should enter his prime around 22 and still keep improving for the duration of the deal. Obviously it is a gamble, but that is the way of the most recent CBA. $4M on the UFA market only buys fading guys like Naslund. $3.5M buys Satan.

Staal is an infinitely better deal than the crap on the UFA market.
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