Rooting for team to lose.

[cake45]

I'm not rooting for them to lose, but I am kind of hoping that events with other teams force them to miss the playoffs again. I get the line of thinking that with Sid, Geno, and Letang here, they should be going for it every year...but Hextall and Dubas haven't done a good job of surrounding the core with the right talent. Mainly, they've surrounding and aging core with a bunch more aging players.

They've had plenty of opportunities to get younger the past 3 years (from outside the organization) and they've chosen not to. In my view, the window is closed because of how they have constructed the team. But I'll still root for them to win. I'm not going to curl up in the corner and cry if they make the playoffs or heaven forbid win an actual round.

Absolutely get where you're coming from. It's a tough spot, wanting success for the team but also recognizing the need for a shift in strategy. Aging cores need fresh talent, and it seems like that hasn't been a priority. The balance between going for it and building for the future can be tricky. Still, fingers crossed for a playoff run, and who knows, maybe a shakeup in strategy could come in the offseason. Here's to hoping for the best while keeping a realistic eye on the team's needs.

[cake45]

Nobody is rooting for the team to lose, rather the people who want them to fail more now in order to accelerate the inevitable changes they see as necessary, as Puck-Lurker says, are looking for an outcome they believe will result in more winning sooner compared to what they believe is the current pattern that will result in losing more for longer. Many see complete and total collapse as the only thing that will force the organization to make the moves and changes they believe are necessary for the longer term health and competitiveness of the franchise.

Some want the team to face short-term challenges in order to force necessary long-term changes for future success.

[yinzer69]

I'm not rooting for them to lose, but I am kind of hoping that events with other teams force them to miss the playoffs again. I get the line of thinking that with Sid, Geno, and Letang here, they should be going for it every year...but Hextall and Dubas haven't done a good job of surrounding the core with the right talent. Mainly, they've surrounding and aging core with a bunch more aging players.

They've had plenty of opportunities to get younger the past 3 years (from outside the organization) and they've chosen not to. In my view, the window is closed because of how they have constructed the team. But I'll still root for them to win. I'm not going to curl up in the corner and cry if they make the playoffs or heaven forbid win an actual round.

Dubas has been on the job for not even a year and already being lumped in with Hextall....classic. This kinda thinking will be there when fire Sully and hire a new coach...the first 3 game loosing streak this board will be calling for the coaches head. Just classic.

[FLPensFan]

I'm not rooting for them to lose, but I am kind of hoping that events with other teams force them to miss the playoffs again. I get the line of thinking that with Sid, Geno, and Letang here, they should be going for it every year...but Hextall and Dubas haven't done a good job of surrounding the core with the right talent. Mainly, they've surrounding and aging core with a bunch more aging players.

They've had plenty of opportunities to get younger the past 3 years (from outside the organization) and they've chosen not to. In my view, the window is closed because of how they have constructed the team. But I'll still root for them to win. I'm not going to curl up in the corner and cry if they make the playoffs or heaven forbid win an actual round.

Dubas has been on the job for not even a year and already being lumped in with Hextall....classic. This kinda thinking will be there when fire Sully and hire a new coach...the first 3 game loosing streak this board will be calling for the coaches head. Just classic.

Try some reading comprehension...it helps understand posts. So does not making assumptions to fit you're narrative. I'm not "lumping" Dubas in with Hextall. I'm making a factual statement that neither of these GMs have surrounded the core with the right type of players. Having an aging core is fine. Surrounding a mid-30's core with a bunch more mid-30's players in Rust, Rakell, Carter, Acciari, Eller and Nieto wasn't the right way to go.

"Lumping" Dubas in with Hextall would be me making statements like "Dubas is just as bad as Hextall was." Haven't done that. Have a nice day.

[yinzer69]

try having a conversation without being a condescending prick. Mods can I get some help here? I literally got attacked because I didn't agree with his statement. Aren't we all adults here supposedly?

[yinzer69]

I'm not rooting for them to lose, but I am kind of hoping that events with other teams force them to miss the playoffs again. I get the line of thinking that with Sid, Geno, and Letang here, they should be going for it every year...but Hextall and Dubas haven't done a good job of surrounding the core with the right talent. Mainly, they've surrounding and aging core with a bunch more aging players.

They've had plenty of opportunities to get younger the past 3 years (from outside the organization) and they've chosen not to. In my view, the window is closed because of how they have constructed the team. But I'll still root for them to win. I'm not going to curl up in the corner and cry if they make the playoffs or heaven forbid win an actual round.

Dubas has been on the job for not even a year and already being lumped in with Hextall....classic. This kinda thinking will be there when fire Sully and hire a new coach...the first 3 game loosing streak this board will be calling for the coaches head. Just classic.

Try some reading comprehension...it helps understand posts. So does not making assumptions to fit you're narrative. I'm not "lumping" Dubas in with Hextall. I'm making a factual statement that neither of these GMs have surrounded the core with the right type of players. Having an aging core is fine. Surrounding a mid-30's core with a bunch more mid-30's players in Rust, Rakell, Carter, Acciari, Eller and Nieto wasn't the right way to go.

"Lumping" Dubas in with Hextall would be me making statements like "Dubas is just as bad as Hextall was." Haven't done that. Have a nice day.

now back to hockey. I disagree again with you. All those players (except Nieto) have contributed in a positive fashion at some point of the course of the last few seasons. We can point to Carter's contract extension was bad....yes and he struggled badly last year but since the benching I actually think he has been fine in his role. Rakell was a VERY good last year, not sure anyone saw the drop off coming. Eller is playing fantastic, Acciari provides good PK and 4th line work. Even in a down year Rust potted 20 goals last year. Goaltending and inconsistent play (maybe the system...maybe the coaching) and lack of bottom 6 depth has been the major problems. Other than Carter's struggles last year I don't see age playing much of a factor.

I give Dubas pretty high marks for his work so far...the only true miss has been Graves. Karlsson was worth it just to dump all those bad contracts. Neito hasn't played much or done much but he is making under a million so who gives a frig.

[BigMcK]

try having a conversation without being a condescending prick. Mods can I get some help here? I literally got attacked because I didn't agree with his statement. Aren't we all adults here supposedly?

Just throwing this out there, but when your first sentence is this: "I am sure I am going to get blasted by all the know it all "fans"", maybe don't feel 'attacked' when you get blasted by a fan???

[Guinness]

I'm not rooting for them to lose, but I am kind of hoping that events with other teams force them to miss the playoffs again. I get the line of thinking that with Sid, Geno, and Letang here, they should be going for it every year...but Hextall and Dubas haven't done a good job of surrounding the core with the right talent. Mainly, they've surrounding and aging core with a bunch more aging players.

They've had plenty of opportunities to get younger the past 3 years (from outside the organization) and they've chosen not to. In my view, the window is closed because of how they have constructed the team. But I'll still root for them to win. I'm not going to curl up in the corner and cry if they make the playoffs or heaven forbid win an actual round.

Dubas has been on the job for not even a year and already being lumped in with Hextall....classic. This kinda thinking will be there when fire Sully and hire a new coach...the first 3 game loosing streak this board will be calling for the coaches head. Just classic.

Try some reading comprehension...it helps understand posts. So does not making assumptions to fit you're narrative. I'm not "lumping" Dubas in with Hextall. I'm making a factual statement that neither of these GMs have surrounded the core with the right type of players. Having an aging core is fine. Surrounding a mid-30's core with a bunch more mid-30's players in Rust, Rakell, Carter, Acciari, Eller and Nieto wasn't the right way to go.

"Lumping" Dubas in with Hextall would be me making statements like "Dubas is just as bad as Hextall was." Haven't done that. Have a nice day.

now back to hockey. I disagree again with you. All those players (except Nieto) have contributed in a positive fashion at some point of the course of the last few seasons. We can point to Carter's contract extension was bad....yes and he struggled badly last year but since the benching I actually think he has been fine in his role. Rakell was a VERY good last year, not sure anyone saw the drop off coming. Eller is playing fantastic, Acciari provides good PK and 4th line work. Even in a down year Rust potted 20 goals last year. Goaltending and inconsistent play (maybe the system...maybe the coaching) and lack of bottom 6 depth has been the major problems. Other than Carter's struggles last year I don't see age playing much of a factor.

I give Dubas pretty high marks for his work so far...the only true miss has been Graves. Karlsson was worth it just to dump all those bad contracts. Neito hasn't played much or done much but he is making under a million so who gives a frig.

I agree - it's been a tough row to hoe for Dubas, coming in with the cap situation he had, and the free agency situation last summer... there just weren't players out there that could really make a difference. But he did shake things up. I think the Karlsson trade was a big swing and it's probably going to play out well in the long run.

Regarding Graves... there really isn't anything in his past performance to suggest that his current play is indicative that it's typical of his normal game. Sometimes players just need a little time to adjust and acclimate. We've seen it on multiple occasions - Paul Martin, one might even throw Ryan Whitney into that group even though we drafted him. And certainly one of the top... I don't know... 10 defensemen in PGH history, Sergei Gonchar? Defense is a tricky position to settle into... we've seen it so many times. Yeah I would love it if Gravy came in and just fit in seamlessly, but that doesn't often happen. I'm willing to be patient with him.

[FLPensFan]

I'm not rooting for them to lose, but I am kind of hoping that events with other teams force them to miss the playoffs again. I get the line of thinking that with Sid, Geno, and Letang here, they should be going for it every year...but Hextall and Dubas haven't done a good job of surrounding the core with the right talent. Mainly, they've surrounding and aging core with a bunch more aging players.

They've had plenty of opportunities to get younger the past 3 years (from outside the organization) and they've chosen not to. In my view, the window is closed because of how they have constructed the team. But I'll still root for them to win. I'm not going to curl up in the corner and cry if they make the playoffs or heaven forbid win an actual round.

Dubas has been on the job for not even a year and already being lumped in with Hextall....classic. This kinda thinking will be there when fire Sully and hire a new coach...the first 3 game loosing streak this board will be calling for the coaches head. Just classic.

Try some reading comprehension...it helps understand posts. So does not making assumptions to fit you're narrative. I'm not "lumping" Dubas in with Hextall. I'm making a factual statement that neither of these GMs have surrounded the core with the right type of players. Having an aging core is fine. Surrounding a mid-30's core with a bunch more mid-30's players in Rust, Rakell, Carter, Acciari, Eller and Nieto wasn't the right way to go.

"Lumping" Dubas in with Hextall would be me making statements like "Dubas is just as bad as Hextall was." Haven't done that. Have a nice day.

now back to hockey. I disagree again with you. All those players (except Nieto) have contributed in a positive fashion at some point of the course of the last few seasons. We can point to Carter's contract extension was bad....yes and he struggled badly last year but since the benching I actually think he has been fine in his role. Rakell was a VERY good last year, not sure anyone saw the drop off coming. Eller is playing fantastic, Acciari provides good PK and 4th line work. Even in a down year Rust potted 20 goals last year. Goaltending and inconsistent play (maybe the system...maybe the coaching) and lack of bottom 6 depth has been the major problems. Other than Carter's struggles last year I don't see age playing much of a factor.

I give Dubas pretty high marks for his work so far...the only true miss has been Graves. Karlsson was worth it just to dump all those bad contracts. Neito hasn't played much or done much but he is making under a million so who gives a frig.

I agree that these guys have made some positive contributions. Nieto has been a huge disappointment for me, and Acciari hasn't been stellar either. I've given Acciari some benefit of the doubt because I know he SHOULD be a much better player on the wing, they just won't put him there. Carter, still overpaid, has been better this year and so far, Sullivan has limited his "stupid use" of him in odd situations.

Eller has been a grand slam for Dubas. I wasn't as down on him as some others were, but he had greatly exceeded expectations. Not only on the ice, but he seems to be the "Brooks Orpik" of the locker room, meaning he usually tells it how it is whether the team is playing good or bad.

Karlsson has been somewhat of a disappointment, but, I suspect Sullivan and his system have more to do with it than Karlsson having an age-based decline issue.

The problem is, what happens to this team in March and April. Crosby was noticeably worn down last year and, considering how much he has carried this team at times with less help from Malkin. Geno is on track for his first non-injury season under a point per game pace. March, April, and if they make...May, is when there is going to be heavy concerns about the age of this team and the legs they have left.

[yinzer69]

I am actually in favor of trading 59 at the deadline, get a 1st and whatever other younger asset(s) u can then potentially trade that 1st in the off-season for immediate help. Heck try to resign Jake in that scenario too.

[FLPensFan]

try having a conversation without being a condescending prick. Mods can I get some help here? I literally got attacked because I didn't agree with his statement. Aren't we all adults here supposedly?

I responded to your post below. I took issue because there wasn't a disagreement with my opinion. There was "putting words into my mouth" that I didn't make, and then throwing a couple of offhand "classic" jabs in there. I have an opinion, just like everyone else here. I am willing to listen to anyone else's dissenting opinion when they come with facts or show the attempt to have a meaningful discussion about it. Sometimes, I even get my mind changed on my opinion. There wasn't much in that initial response from you that fit that mold.

I'd much rather respond to reply you had, disagreeing with my view.

[BlackNGold4Life]

My happiness has been attacked with the status of this team. Lol.

In all seriousness - like most of us have wanted and said. We need a lot more youthful talent infused into this team. Not just youth for youths sake, but some hunger. This team has no “it” factor and lacks identity.

Huge pieces that have really hurt us.

Riley Smith not producing as he should.
Rakell not playing well at all
Rust falling off a cliff. That’s 3 of 4 of our top wingers to start the season. And allot of secondary production.

At the deadline. We don’t have many contacts we can move. NTC or other factors. Smith, Raks - POJ. That’s about it.

[Scott]

Always root for them to win. Also realize that the window is closing quickly and some hard decisions will need to happen sooner than later...

That ship has sailed.

It wasn't a "hard decision needs to be made" until they made decisions cementing it impossible to win.

[FLPensFan]

Rust falling off a cliff. That’s 3 of 4 of our top wingers to start the season. And allot of secondary production.

What am I missing on Bryan Rust? I keep seeing people saying he's awful or had a sharp decline. He's been injured, which is nothing new, but he has 13 goals in 36 games. That's 29 goals over an 82 game season. He's got 29 points in 36 games, which translates to 66 points over an 82 game season. Both of those numbers would be career highs. He went 9 games without a goal, but that was sandwiched around his 10 game injury. Other than that, he hasn't gone more than 3 games without a goal. He's near the top in all the fancy stats categories for the team.

What am I missing here? Did I like signing him to 6 years with a full NMC the first 3 years? No. But he's definitely far down the list of problems on this team for me.

[RisslingsMissingTeeth]

At least I know I am not alone in how I process this all. I definitely do not root for the Pens to lose but I really don't want them making the playoffs. Why? Because the NHL has changed and become a younger person's sport and 7 or so years ago I begged and pleaded for the Pens to stop chasing some theoretical window of its aging stars and start the rebuild when guys still had value. Instead they produced the oldest roster in the NHL. You can't be rewarded for that braindead strategy.

[KG]

I don't root for them to lose, but I do want them to bring in a new coaching staff...which will only happen if they lose...So how's that for a wishy-washy answer.

[lemieuxReturns]

Rust falling off a cliff. That’s 3 of 4 of our top wingers to start the season. And allot of secondary production.

What am I missing on Bryan Rust? I keep seeing people saying he's awful or had a sharp decline. He's been injured, which is nothing new, but he has 13 goals in 36 games. That's 29 goals over an 82 game season. He's got 29 points in 36 games, which translates to 66 points over an 82 game season. Both of those numbers would be career highs. He went 9 games without a goal, but that was sandwiched around his 10 game injury. Other than that, he hasn't gone more than 3 games without a goal. He's near the top in all the fancy stats categories for the team.

What am I missing here? Did I like signing him to 6 years with a full NMC the first 3 years? No. But he's definitely far down the list of problems on this team for me.

My top 3 biggest disappointments are :
EK
Rakell
Smith

Honorable Mention :
Graves

[Pens4Life]

Rust falling off a cliff. That’s 3 of 4 of our top wingers to start the season. And allot of secondary production.

What am I missing on Bryan Rust? I keep seeing people saying he's awful or had a sharp decline. He's been injured, which is nothing new, but he has 13 goals in 36 games. That's 29 goals over an 82 game season. He's got 29 points in 36 games, which translates to 66 points over an 82 game season. Both of those numbers would be career highs. He went 9 games without a goal, but that was sandwiched around his 10 game injury. Other than that, he hasn't gone more than 3 games without a goal. He's near the top in all the fancy stats categories for the team.

What am I missing here? Did I like signing him to 6 years with a full NMC the first 3 years? No. But he's definitely far down the list of problems on this team for me.

Yep,I agree.. Rust isnt a among serious problems,he is still efficient,if he wouldnt get injured,numbers would be even better.

Problems are :
Sullivan stubbern system and forcing players into it..
EK65 seems lost, system?
Graves seems lost, system?
Rakell seems lost, system and attitude?
Malkin age, always was defensive black hole
Smith, personal issues it seems.. I didnt like trade for him anyway,would rather kept Zucker,who is hustler and comeback season..
Missuing players like Acciari, Puustinen and others mentioned
Power Play disaster.. nothing changed
3rd and 4th line potential is there,but with this coach,it seems some things will never change
Etc etc

[Wyopen]

If you want to get ur message across, people need to stop going to the games. Maybe management will act then.

[Maestro]

No need to root for this team to lose. 5+ years of data indicate they do that just fine on their own.