Non-Pirates Baseball Thread

[pittsports87]

King Felix has also had the advantage of pitching in completely meaningless games since about mid-May. If you think that doesn't matter, look at the Javier Vasquez discussion earlier in the thread.

The difference is that Vasquez had 1 very good year in 2009. For the most part, he has been a pitcher with an ERA over 4. Felix has had 4 very good years in a row and has gotten better each year.

[Rocco]

King Felix has also had the advantage of pitching in completely meaningless games since about mid-May. If you think that doesn't matter, look at the Javier Vasquez discussion earlier in the thread.

The difference is that Vasquez had 1 very good year in 2009. For the most part, he has been a pitcher with an ERA over 4. Felix has had 4 very good years in a row and has gotten better each year.

I agree that F-Her is better than Vasquez and that he's been a monster this season. That wasn't really my point. My point is that there's a difference between pitching for a team in the hunt and pitching for a team that's miles out of the race. Vasquez's best years have come on teams that weren't contending for anything, and it's happened often enough that I don't think it's an accident. You can't discount that factor, just like how you can't discount run support and park effects (Safeco's traditionally been a pitcher-friendly park). Pitching for a bad team doesn't disqualify you for the Cy Young. If a guy does what Steve Carlton did in 1972, he deserves the award.

If I had a vote, it would be for David Price. I won't mind if Felix gets the award because anything that makes "wins are all-important" morons like John Kruk blubber makes me happy.

[beerman]

I agree that F-Her is better than Vasquez and that he's been a monster this season. That wasn't really my point. My point is that there's a difference between pitching for a team in the hunt and pitching for a team that's miles out of the race. Vasquez's best years have come on teams that weren't contending for anything, and it's happened often enough that I don't think it's an accident. You can't discount that factor, just like how you can't discount run support and park effects (Safeco's traditionally been a pitcher-friendly park). Pitching for a bad team doesn't disqualify you for the Cy Young. If a guy does what Steve Carlton did in 1972, he deserves the award.

If I had a vote, it would be for David Price. I won't mind if Felix gets the award because anything that makes "wins are all-important" morons like John Kruk blubber makes me happy.

Pitching on a team miles out of the race didn't keep Greinke from winning last year. Whether the games mean anything to the Mariners or not they did to the teams they were playing. In the second half he took the ball 8 times against teams that either made the playoffs (NY, Min and Texas) or the closest contenders (ChiSox - who were leading the division both times he faced them, and Boston - had the chance to cut the lead to under 4 games against Felix). In those games he only compiled a 4-3 record, but all 8 were quality starts, and his shortest outing was 6 2/3. Overall he pitched 60 innings with a 1.64 era, 51k and a WHIP well under 1. The M's scored a grand total of 18 runs, thanks to offensive explosions of 6 and 4 in NY and Boston respectively, in those games and were shutout twice.

Good point on the park effects of pitching in Safeco. It certainly helps to pitch half your games in that park, his numbers are better at Safeco than they are on the road but he's also been great on the road, better than either CC or Price:
Felix: 18 road starts, 131.2 IP, 2.46 era, 1.139 whip
CC: 18 road starts, 126.2, 3.34 era, 1.255 whip
Price: 15 road starts, 93 IP, 3.68 era, 1.387 whip

[SolidSnake]

Things are gettin crazy
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/recap?gameId=301002126" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[beerman]

Playoff matchups set:

Texas vs Tampa
New York vs Minnesota

Cincinnati vs Philly
Atlanta vs San Francisco

Every series but Atl-SF starts on Wednesday.

[beerman]

Philly and SF are about the only two teams with any momentum heading into the playoffs and SF still almost found a way to blow it.

Records since Sept 1 among playoff teams:
Philly 22-7
SF 16-10
Minn 17-12 but lost 8 of last 10
Texas 15-14
Tampa 14-15
Cincy 13-16
Atl 13-16
NYY 12-17

If their pitching holds up Philly has to be the favorite at least in the NL. The AL looks wide open.

[Troy Loney]

Playoff matchups set:

Texas vs Tampa
New York vs Minnesota

Cincinnati vs Philly
Atlanta vs San Francisco

Every series but Atl-SF starts on Wednesday.

Come on Minnesota!!!

[shafnutz05]

I really (REALLY) hope the Phillies are knocked out early, but I just don't see it happening. Phillies Phever is in full effect down here...even the embarrassing Eagles loss yesterday was tempered by the excitement over the Phillies. Cincinnati in 3 pl0x

[MWB]

Philly and SF are about the only two teams with any momentum heading into the playoffs and SF still almost found a way to blow it.

Records since Sept 1 among playoff teams:
Philly 22-7
SF 16-10
Minn 17-12 but lost 8 of last 10
Texas 15-14
Tampa 14-15
Cincy 13-16
Atl 13-16
NYY 12-17

If their pitching holds up Philly has to be the favorite at least in the NL. The AL looks wide open.

I forget where, but I read something recently that said momentum going into the playoffs is pretty meaningless. I do think Philly's in the best shape though.

[beerman]

Yeah, it shouldn't have too much effect because everyone in the AL has sucked lately so someone will turn it around, simply because they have too. Even if Philly goes and wins it all it wouldn't be because of momentum, they probably just have the best team. Great pitching, pretty good offense and they play on a little league field.

[Idoit40fans]

I'm thrilled that the Braves got the Giants. Only team they have a chance against with the way they're playing right now. Making the playoffs as a Wild Card leaves such an empty feeling. I'm not sure if I can even root for them, especially with the way they collapsed this past month or so. I mean I will be pulling for them, but they've been frustrating.

[SolidSnake]

Feels like old times with the braves back in

[Idoit40fans]

It feels wrong.

[SolidSnake]

It feels wrong.

They should of brought Maddux, Glavine, Smoltz out of retirement and reaquired Andrew Jones

[Idoit40fans]

It feels wrong.

They should of brought Maddux, Glavine, Smoltz out of retirement and reaquired Andrew Jones

They should have held onto the division.

[MWB]

Morneau is now out for the entire playoffs. Not sure that it really matters since they've played the whole second half without him, but I'm sure they were hoping to have him back.

[Point Breeze Penguins]

It feels wrong.

They should of brought Maddux, Glavine, Smoltz out of retirement and reaquired Andrew Jones

...and Mark Lemke.

[Point Breeze Penguins]

Looks like a whole 1/3 of the league will be looking for new managers.

[SolidSnake]

It feels wrong.

They should of brought Maddux, Glavine, Smoltz out of retirement and reaquired Andrew Jones

...and Mark Lemke.

Jeff Blauser was my boy

[Idoit40fans]

Keith Lockhart ftw.

[Malkamaniac]

I40, what happened to Mcann on the Braves? Is he hurt? Too lazy to look.

[shafnutz05]

When I was much younger, I remember how I used to think Otis Nixon looked WAY beyond his age (I thought he looked like an emaciated 70 year old). To a lesser extent, I thought Jeff Blauser looked older beyond his years, and not in a good way. When I asked my Mom why they looked so old, she said "because they do cocaine and smoke cigarettes".

[MWB]

I used to think the same thing about Nixon. He was a fast old man.

[shafnutz05]

lol while on the topic of ugly baseball players, Don Mossi:

[Idoit40fans]

I40, what happened to Mcann on the Braves? Is he hurt? Too lazy to look.

What do you mean? He's been playing.