LGP Education thread

[dodint]

Thanks.

Given this was one of the biggest videos trending on YouTube today I'm curious what the majority of people took away from it.

[MWB]

This is the problem, that a 1 minute video is what is trending today. Most likely full of comments like, "OMG, what are they teaching these kids!" No context. Very little knowledge on the topic. Very little desire to do anything more than complain.
Dodint, I'm not directing that at you, that's just the overall perception I get from people who rail against CC.

[dodint]

Oh, it's fine, no hard feelings. Like I said, I don't have a dog in the fight. I just thought the video itself was subtly misleading and both sides would use it as 'proof' that their side is right, whatever that is. I'm more interested in the discourse than the actual problem.

[count2infinity]

Is phonics still around?
My oldest brother told me about knowing how to read when he got to first grade and the phonics stuff totally messed with his reading ability (for a period of time).

My youngest sister learned ready by what's called "site words". You don't look at words and try to pronounce small pieces, you learn a set of words (and by set I mean many many small words) just from memorization and build a foundation of how phonics work from that on your own. I don't know if it's better or worse than phonics, but it's definitely different. That was 10 years ago though... it very well may have changed in that time.

I agree that jumping to that step in the video would not be good. But I don't think that is being done. That was a 1 minute video illustrating one way to get kids to learn one standard of common core, the standard being numbers in base 10. That if kids can understand how to get to 10s, things are a lot easier. It's not meant to be a tool for how to do every addition problem.

Like I said earlier... what's shown in the video is actually how I do some addition as well. But it goes beyond that... let's say I'm adding 27 and 29. I know 25 and 25 is 50 and 2 + 4 is 6, so 56. Now I fully understand that this method does not work for everyone. This is a technique that I developed individually as I worked my way through school. I do not encourage it being taught at a young age, but for some like me, the brain just works better thinking in terms like that. That's one of the biggest issues with education right now. Everyone wants one single way to teach something best... where's the magic bullet that makes it click in every single kids head? It doesn't exist, you have to use a variety of techniques to teach to the variety of ways kids think.

[Pavel Bure]

Yeah I have no problem with the video. It's how teaching works. You intro a concept, explain it, and model it. Anyone that thinks common core is saying this is the only way to add is naive. She shows this way because 5s and 10s are very easy to work with. I've seen many children that gawk at 9+6 but have no problem with 10+5. So I do show them to break the six into a 5 and 1 to make a 10.

Another example is multiplication. Many students grasp their basic facts up to x12 very well but when presented with double and triple digit multiplication they struggle. Many times the lattice method of multiplying clicks for them.

There are many different ways to accomplish math and to put down any if them is disservice to education. Everyone learns in different ways and the more ways that can be found to teach something the better off students are.

[Factorial]

I never even considered the need to multiply anything beyond the basic multiplication table in my head. Is this something taught now? How to multiply 236x456 without pencil and paper or a calculator?

[count2infinity]

no, large multiplications like that are not taught without a pen and pencil. But when I don't have a calculator or pen and paper close by, I do something similar to the video... 19 x 5... no clue off the top of my head, but I know 20 x 5 is 100 and 1x5 is 5, 100-5 is 95. It's just quick things I do in my head without ever really being taught these things, but now they're being taught as an alternative to strict memorization or pen and paper.

[Pavel Bure]

I never even considered the need to multiply anything beyond the basic multiplication table in my head. Is this something taught now? How to multiply 236x456 without pencil and paper or a calculator?

No the traditional method is putting 456 on top and 236 on the bottom. It becomes confusing because of the steps, putting a zero in the ones place and the te ones and tens place, and remembering to erase/cross out what you already carried. Yes many students struggle with the concept presented that way. The lattice method is simply another way to do it. As far as the problem above, if I wanted students to do it without paper/calculator would be to get them to split it into 200x400, 30x50, and 6x6. Again that goes back to tens being super easy to work with.

Edit: I hate autocorrect.

[MWB]

There are many different ways to accomplish math and to put down any if them is disservice to education. Everyone learns in different ways and the more ways that can be found to teach something the better off students are.

:thumb:
This guy gets it. Any teacher who is any good will teach something a variety of ways because he's got 20-30 kids in the room who learn in a variety of ways. And who knows, maybe even the kid who already gets it one way will find another way more useful in future problems.

[MWB]

Quote from a teacher in NJ which sums up how a lot of teachers fe right now:
"I am no longer certain about what my job description is these days; am I a teacher, one who attempts to engage students and help them understand subject matter and their world, or am I a data collector, one who keeps statistics on all manner of measurables in a theoretical attempt to improve the process of teaching in which I am often not engaged because I am busy collecting the data?"

[count2infinity]

When an employee doesn't know what they're to be doing because the rules and job descriptions change on a yearly basis, the product is going to be bad.

[Pavel Bure]

Quote from a teacher in NJ which sums up how a lot of teachers fe right now:
"I am no longer certain about what my job description is these days; am I a teacher, one who attempts to engage students and help them understand subject matter and their world, or am I a data collector, one who keeps statistics on all manner of measurables in a theoretical attempt to improve the process of teaching in which I am often not engaged because I am busy collecting the data?"

This was my experience in a charter school. Every question was met with, "What does the data say?"

Teacher: This child is clearly struggling because there's something not right at home and it's manifesting itself in school

Response: Well... what does the data say? You need to have higher expectations and engage the student.

Teacher: ...What?

[MWB]

Definitely not that extreme where I work, but the state and district require lots and lots of assessments. The first month of school is basically assessments.

[count2infinity]

it'll certainly be amped up at a charter school. they need the data to stay in business. public schools it isn't as terrible, unless you're in math. then it's everything.

[columbia]

it'll certainly be amped up at a charter school. they need the data to stay in business.

It's not a great selling point for private charter schools.

[MWB]

it'll certainly be amped up at a charter school. they need the data to stay in business. public schools it isn't as terrible, unless you're in math. then it's everything.

Things are changing very quickly. Data is becoming everything across the board.

[MWB]

There are three things that have positively affected the quality of Finnish schools that are absent in American schools. First, Finland has built a school system that has over time strengthened educational equity. This means early childhood education for all children, funding all schools so they can better serve those with special educational needs, access to health and well-being services for all children in all schools, and a national curriculum that insists that schools focus on the whole child rather than narrow academic achievement.

Second, teachers in Finland have time to work together with their colleagues during the school day. According to the most recent data provided by the OECD the average teaching load of junior high school teachers in Finland is about half what it is in the United States. That enables teachers to build professional networks, share ideas and best practices. This is an important condition to enhancing teaching quality.

Finally, play constitutes a significant part of individual growth and learning in Finnish schools. Every class must be followed by a 15-minute recess break so children can spend time outside on their own activities. Schooldays are also shorter in Finland than in the United States, and primary schools keep the homework load to a minimum so students have time for their own hobbies and friends when school is over.

http://www.cnn.com/2014/10/06/opinion/s ... ?c=&page=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[count2infinity]

I think that second part is huge. I remember when I was teaching it was non-stop from the start of the day to the end. I got lunch and I got a planning period that was often taken away because I had to cover someone else's class. I don't think it's just networking in those off times, it's just a matter of taking a break, resetting yourself and then getting ready for the next class. I know that would be a scheduling nightmare, but given a short break of 10-15 minutes between classes would have sufficed. In my high school we got 3.5 minutes and had to be in the hallway monitoring kids during that time.

[MWB]

And if it's that way for teachers, it makes sense that it would benefit kids as well to have those short breaks like #3 talks about.

[dodint]

Do you suppose those Finnish schools have block scheduling? If my school forced a 15 minute break every 40 minutes 9 times a day I'd have dropped out. I really hate wasted/idle time and an extra 2hr 15min a day standing around in our cliques would've drove me to drink.

[MWB]

45 minutes of class, 15 minutes off for elementary. Five hours a day.

[count2infinity]

[youtube][/youtube]

[PensFanInDC]

Good video and I like what he had to say about all of the topics especially the role of teachers.

I did think it was funny that he said "There is no significant difference between animated or static visuals" and the followed that with "Some data showed that static visuals offered a better teaching method..." I know he means that some found static better than animated (and some would find animated better than static) but it was not a "significant amount".

[MWB]

Yeah, I agree with most of it as well. Technology in the classroom is definitely an evolution, not revolution. As for static versus animated, variety is the spice of life, and a way to keep things interesting. Depending on the material, different things work better and are more effective.

[count2infinity]

Agreed on all counts. What I took away from the video is exactly what I've always said when it comes to education, there is no silver bullet, despite everyone looking for one. While all these things help students, and while teaching I had used video (and gifs) and static images depending on what I'm attempting to demonstrate. Sometimes it was just easier to do an in class demonstration, sometimes it's enough to just describe it. Every student is different, every subject is different, every teacher is different (in strengths and weaknesses), so the idea that one particular thing is going to "revolutionize" education is ridiculous to me. Will it enhance learning? Sure, but not revolutionize and be a cure-all.