Jake to Carolina

[KG]

Necas might be available for trade...

[Pitts]

Or, just sign in free agency.

[KG]

Or, just sign in free agency.

Necas is an RFA.

[KG]

Rumors out there that Carolina is going to buyout Kotkaniemi. He should have interest to the Pens. Young center.

[lemieuxReturns]

Rumors out there that Carolina is going to buyout Kotkaniemi. He should have interest to the Pens. Young center.

I was trying to google what the story was with that guy but my skills suck today.

If I remember right, he was with the Canadians and the Hurricanes were upset with an offer sheet that Montreal had done with a Cane player. The Canes then decided to offer sheet Kotkaniemi. I guess Carolina ended up with the kid and its been downhill ever since?

[FLPensFan]

Rumors out there that Carolina is going to buyout Kotkaniemi. He should have interest to the Pens. Young center.

I was trying to google what the story was with that guy but my skills suck today.

If I remember right, he was with the Canadians and the Hurricanes were upset with an offer sheet that Montreal had done with a Cane player. The Canes then decided to offer sheet Kotkaniemi. I guess Carolina ended up with the kid and its been downhill ever since?

Kotkaniemi was a #3 overall pick for Montreal in 2018. Montreal brought him to the NHL immediately. 18 goals, 43 points last year (not this current season) are his high totals so far. Montreal offer sheeted Sebastian Aho, and Carolina matched. 2 years later, Carolina, as retaliation, offer sheeted Kotkaniemi to a 1 year, 6.1M deal.

Kotkaniemi is a decent player. He was very tall and lanky when he first came into the NHL (like 6 foot, 170lbs). He's filled out a bit more, but, he's unlikely to ever live up to his 3rd overall status. He probably will top out as an 18-22 goal, 45-55 point player in the NHL.

I need to do some research this weekend on the importance of LH/RH centermen. I still think that is going to be an issue. The Penguins have no right-handed centers on the roster or in the system. Acciari is the only RH faceoff guy they have, and I really hate to go into the season with that being the case and having to lean heavily on Acciari.

This is why I continue to beat the Shane Pinto drum for 3C...or Nashville's Colton Sissons as a backup. CapFriendly lists only 83 players as right handed centers (some are wing/center combos), and only 44 of those players had points in the NHL last year. Compared to 104 LH centers, with 93 having at least 1 point.

I want to look at rosters to see if anyone has all leftys, their success, and how much left vs right handedness on a draw is important.

[Pens4Life]

Brind'Amour - I wonder if he stays with Carolina, I would swap him for Sullivan heh..

[dark_forces]

Rumors out there that Carolina is going to buyout Kotkaniemi. He should have interest to the Pens. Young center.

I was trying to google what the story was with that guy but my skills suck today.

If I remember right, he was with the Canadians and the Hurricanes were upset with an offer sheet that Montreal had done with a Cane player. The Canes then decided to offer sheet Kotkaniemi. I guess Carolina ended up with the kid and its been downhill ever since?

Kotkaniemi was a #3 overall pick for Montreal in 2018. Montreal brought him to the NHL immediately. 18 goals, 43 points last year (not this current season) are his high totals so far. Montreal offer sheeted Sebastian Aho, and Carolina matched. 2 years later, Carolina, as retaliation, offer sheeted Kotkaniemi to a 1 year, 6.1M deal.

Kotkaniemi is a decent player. He was very tall and lanky when he first came into the NHL (like 6 foot, 170lbs). He's filled out a bit more, but, he's unlikely to ever live up to his 3rd overall status. He probably will top out as an 18-22 goal, 45-55 point player in the NHL.

I need to do some research this weekend on the importance of LH/RH centermen. I still think that is going to be an issue. The Penguins have no right-handed centers on the roster or in the system. Acciari is the only RH faceoff guy they have, and I really hate to go into the season with that being the case and having to lean heavily on Acciari.

This is why I continue to beat the Shane Pinto drum for 3C...or Nashville's Colton Sissons as a backup. CapFriendly lists only 83 players as right handed centers (some are wing/center combos), and only 44 of those players had points in the NHL last year. Compared to 104 LH centers, with 93 having at least 1 point.

I want to look at rosters to see if anyone has all leftys, their success, and how much left vs right handedness on a draw is important.

You would imagine this would strengthen the 3rd line, if he could be had relatively inexpensively. Since we just dealt with Carolina, I imagine the lines of communication would still be open. Either Kotkaniemi or Necas. We could always send back a piece or two from the Guentzel trade.

[Pitts]

Or, just sign in free agency.

Necas is an RFA.

Oooooooooooh... lol. I assumed he was UFA.

[Pitts]

Rumors out there that Carolina is going to buyout Kotkaniemi. He should have interest to the Pens. Young center.

I was trying to google what the story was with that guy but my skills suck today.

If I remember right, he was with the Canadians and the Hurricanes were upset with an offer sheet that Montreal had done with a Cane player. The Canes then decided to offer sheet Kotkaniemi. I guess Carolina ended up with the kid and its been downhill ever since?

Yes. So, pass. He's a very expensive 4th line center

[Puck-Lurker]

To return to the Jake trade, I think it's fair to say we got the better part of that deal.

- Jake as rental to CAR, he wasn't resigning here let's be real.
- Playoffs performance boost to CAR, we weren't going to make it anyway.
- Ty Smith to CAR, obsolete with Karlsson under contract.

- Bunting to PIT, something the team needed, at a reasonable cap hit and 2 more years.
- 44th overall 2nd rounder
- Koivunen
- Ponomarev
- Lucius
Figure at least one or two NHL players from these prospects and pick. It's pretty good considering the market.

[dark_forces]

To return to the Jake trade, I think it's fair to say we got the better part of that deal.

- Jake as rental to CAR, he wasn't resigning here let's be real.
- Playoffs performance boost to CAR, we weren't going to make it anyway.
- Ty Smith to CAR, obsolete with Karlsson under contract.

- Bunting to PIT, something the team needed, at a reasonable cap hit and 2 more years.
- 44th overall 2nd rounder
- Koivunen
- Ponomarev
- Lucius
Figure at least one or two NHL players from these prospects and pick. It's pretty good considering the market.

I'm glad you revisited this! Seeing it laid out again confirms to me, at least, that Dubas did a pretty good job with the return considering the league knew we pretty much had to move Guentzel.

[FLPensFan]

To return to the Jake trade, I think it's fair to say we got the better part of that deal.

- Jake as rental to CAR, he wasn't resigning here let's be real.
- Playoffs performance boost to CAR, we weren't going to make it anyway.
- Ty Smith to CAR, obsolete with Karlsson under contract.

- Bunting to PIT, something the team needed, at a reasonable cap hit and 2 more years.
- 44th overall 2nd rounder
- Koivunen
- Ponomarev
- Lucius
Figure at least one or two NHL players from these prospects and pick. It's pretty good considering the market.

I'm glad you revisited this! Seeing it laid out again confirms to me, at least, that Dubas did a pretty good job with the return considering the league knew we pretty much had to move Guentzel.

As much as I hoped/wanted more, I have no problem with Dubas moving Guentzel or the return he received. I did feel moving Guentzel was the right move to make, and Bunting (despite all the negative buzz from the analytics crowd) was a great add to this team.

I highly anticipate Dubas flipping either one of the 3 prospects he received, or a Poulin/Puustinen/Pickering/Yager type in a deal this summer. Pickering or Yager would have to be for a 24 or younger NHLer for it to be a win for Pittsburgh.

[Antonio]

Jake talking about wanting to stay in Carolina...

"It’s a great place to play. I don’t think you realize the behind the scenes, how good it is."

I remember when the Penguins organization was viewed this way. Really doubt the organization has a reputation as a good, quality organization to be part of like it used to in the Mario days. The statement gives the impression that is also a subtle comment on how much better it was when he was sent there.

[FLPensFan]

Jake talking about wanting to stay in Carolina...

"It’s a great place to play. I don’t think you realize the behind the scenes, how good it is."

I remember when the Penguins organization was viewed this way. Really doubt the organization has a reputation as a good, quality organization to be part of like it used to in the Mario days. The statement gives the impression that is also a subtle comment on how much better it was when he was sent there.

I don't know if I'd go that far. You don't have to go back to the Mario days for players to say this is a great organization. In fact, back in the Mario days, they didn't have great practice facilities, they were still playing in the dumpy Civic Arena, and if players loved it here, it was most likely because they were able to get away with murder in the "country club" days.

Look no further than Jeff Carter. Guy came and played here for 3.5 years, and has decided to buy a house here and remain in the area. This from a former cross-state rival, too. There are several other players (not coming to mind right now) that have only been here a short time yet put roots down here.

Teams have ebbs and flows in terms of the on-ice performance. The Penguins were viewed as a good place to play/live over the past 10-15 years because they had a new arena with great new facilities, a new training complex, and coaches/GMs that were player friendly.

[Antonio]

Yeah perhaps I should clarify a little bit. When I mean the Mario days, I mean the days he was the face of the ownership not when he was a player and it was country club time. Also I'm in no way referring to the Pittsburgh area and community which tons of players seem to love and want to stay in the area with their families as a result of playing here. I meant more the organization itself and the reputation I believe it had especially during the Mario ownership days, where it was such a well-run professional top notch organization, the area and community notwithstanding.

[Cow_Master66]

Has to be close to 100% of rentals/UFAs say something like this....I wouldn't read anything into that statement at all. Like everyone, Jake would love to play for the team that will pay him the most.

[Antonio]

Very possible. Perhaps my perception of just how sour things seem to have gotten at the upper levels for so long from what used to seem like a polar opposite has colored my view of even the most innocuous of statements.

[FLPensFan]

Yeah perhaps I should clarify a little bit. When I mean the Mario days, I mean the days he was the face of the ownership not when he was a player and it was country club time. Also I'm in no way referring to the Pittsburgh area and community which tons of players seem to love and want to stay in the area with their families as a result of playing here. I meant more the organization itself and the reputation I believe it had especially during the Mario ownership days, where it was such a well-run professional top notch organization, the area and community notwithstanding.

Ah, ok, that makes a bit more sense. I don't think Jake like the way he was treated here with his contract negotiation, or lack thereof. I think a lot of us all saw Jake being dealt from a few miles away...just the stage where this team was, it didn't make sense to sign him long term. But, I'm not sure how that was conveyed to Jake. Sounds like Dubas may have handled it poorly, but we just really don't know for sure.

In any event, I think players are also smart enough to see the Penguins are in a down-turn stage. Yeah, it'd be great to play with Crosby, but, do I want to go there for 9M AAV for a 20% chance at the playoffs, or take 8M AAV on a team where I've got a 60% chance of making the playoffs. Just by natural events, Pittsburgh isn't very attractive as a team right now.

All eyes will be on Dubas this summer. He cannot afford another Graves signing, trading for a player like Karlsson to only see a fraction of his potential, or filling out the bottom 6 with older, defensive forwards that cannot contribute offensively. Dubas needs to trade for a young player or two, remold the bottom 6, and hope that Graves and EK65 have a rebound year.

[lemieuxReturns]

If I am Dubas, and If Sid signs for less than his current 8.7 then I am probably going to try and field a competitive team this summer.
But, if Sid wants more than his 8.7 then after re-signing Sid, I am probably going to try and accelerate the rebuild.
I would trade away MP, Rust, Rakell, Smith, Eller, EK, Graves (if possible) and Jarry.
MP would probably net the most.
All players would be traded for picks, prospects or players under the age of 23.
I would wait until a week before the season starts and sign good players to 1 year prove it contracts and let them play on Sid and Geno's lines in hopes that they would inflate their stats for deadline assets.
I would go into the season with hopefully 10M+ of free cap space to allow teams to dump a bad player at the deadline.

Essentially, I would treat this year as a burner.

Watching the playoffs, we are not one or two players away from winning the cup. We need youth.

[IntangibleBeer]

If I am Dubas, and If Sid signs for less than his current 8.7 then I am probably going to try and field a competitive team this summer.
But, if Sid wants more than his 8.7 then after re-signing Sid, I am probably going to try and accelerate the rebuild.
I would trade away MP, Rust, Rakell, Smith, Eller, EK, Graves (if possible) and Jarry.
MP would probably net the most.
All players would be traded for picks, prospects or players under the age of 23.
I would wait until a week before the season starts and sign good players to 1 year prove it contracts and let them play on Sid and Geno's lines in hopes that they would inflate their stats for deadline assets.
I would go into the season with hopefully 10M+ of free cap space to allow teams to dump a bad player at the deadline.

Essentially, I would treat this year as a burner.

Watching the playoffs, we are not one or two players away from winning the cup. We need youth.

It’s drastic, but probably needed. I expect that Sid will sign for $8.7M or less. Given that the rebuild isn’t accelerated quite that much, I would definitely look to move Jarry, sign Ned, and move the older deadwood for youth (AND play them!).

I also agree that if this team snuck into the playoffs they would be a very easy out - not enough speed, endurance, or resilience. The last 12 games were great, but way too little late.

[FLPensFan]

If I am Dubas, and If Sid signs for less than his current 8.7 then I am probably going to try and field a competitive team this summer.
But, if Sid wants more than his 8.7 then after re-signing Sid, I am probably going to try and accelerate the rebuild.
I would trade away MP, Rust, Rakell, Smith, Eller, EK, Graves (if possible) and Jarry.
MP would probably net the most.
All players would be traded for picks, prospects or players under the age of 23.
I would wait until a week before the season starts and sign good players to 1 year prove it contracts and let them play on Sid and Geno's lines in hopes that they would inflate their stats for deadline assets.
I would go into the season with hopefully 10M+ of free cap space to allow teams to dump a bad player at the deadline.

Essentially, I would treat this year as a burner.

Watching the playoffs, we are not one or two players away from winning the cup. We need youth.

It’s drastic, but probably needed. I expect that Sid will sign for $8.7M or less. Given that the rebuild isn’t accelerated quite that much, I would definitely look to move Jarry, sign Ned, and move the older deadwood for youth (AND play them!).

I also agree that if this team snuck into the playoffs they would be a very easy out - not enough speed, endurance, or resilience. The last 12 games were great, but way too little late.

On Sid, all these national pundits talking about how he may sign for 10-11M. Is his play still at that level? Absolutely. But, I would be very surprised if Sid didn't just take another deal at 8.7M AAV. I think that's 100% how Sid operates. I also think Sid sees where this team has been the last few years, and knows that taking more money means less money to build a better team around him.

I think the market for Jarry is drying up. I felt Edmonton was a clear front runner, but seeing that Skinner has gotten the Oilers into the finals, kind of hard to say Skinner isn't the guy. Plus, I expect Ullmark to be available, Markstrom is long rumored to be on the move. Finally, giving up one year into a multi-year deal isn't something most GMs around the league are going to rush to do.

In terms of the playoffs and an easy out, I found some quotes from Paul Maurice very interesting. He was asked about team fatigue from going deep in the playoffs two years in a row. Maurice said he wondered that very thing going into training camp, and especially knowing that Ekblad, Montour, and Bennett were all out to start the season. Maurice said first day he showed up to camp, he could see the hunger and determination from the team. First day of camp. He was worried, saying "Am I really going to have to rip into Barkov for not going full bore in a drill in September?" Never had to. The team was giving the type of effort in September and October that they needed to give....not dogging it. The effort was there and consistent all season.

This is something I have strongly wondered about the Penguins, because it often seems like in games the past 2 years, they aren't dropping into the extra gear or taking that extra hit to make a play, because the mentality is this game isn't important enough. Until they're all important and you've run out of time.

[KG]

If I am Dubas, and If Sid signs for less than his current 8.7 then I am probably going to try and field a competitive team this summer.
But, if Sid wants more than his 8.7 then after re-signing Sid, I am probably going to try and accelerate the rebuild.
I would trade away MP, Rust, Rakell, Smith, Eller, EK, Graves (if possible) and Jarry.
MP would probably net the most.
All players would be traded for picks, prospects or players under the age of 23.
I would wait until a week before the season starts and sign good players to 1 year prove it contracts and let them play on Sid and Geno's lines in hopes that they would inflate their stats for deadline assets.
I would go into the season with hopefully 10M+ of free cap space to allow teams to dump a bad player at the deadline.

Essentially, I would treat this year as a burner.

Watching the playoffs, we are not one or two players away from winning the cup. We need youth.

It’s drastic, but probably needed. I expect that Sid will sign for $8.7M or less. Given that the rebuild isn’t accelerated quite that much, I would definitely look to move Jarry, sign Ned, and move the older deadwood for youth (AND play them!).

I also agree that if this team snuck into the playoffs they would be a very easy out - not enough speed, endurance, or resilience. The last 12 games were great, but way too little late.

On Sid, all these national pundits talking about how he may sign for 10-11M. Is his play still at that level? Absolutely. But, I would be very surprised if Sid didn't just take another deal at 8.7M AAV. I think that's 100% how Sid operates. I also think Sid sees where this team has been the last few years, and knows that taking more money means less money to build a better team around him.

I think the market for Jarry is drying up. I felt Edmonton was a clear front runner, but seeing that Skinner has gotten the Oilers into the finals, kind of hard to say Skinner isn't the guy. Plus, I expect Ullmark to be available, Markstrom is long rumored to be on the move. Finally, giving up one year into a multi-year deal isn't something most GMs around the league are going to rush to do.

In terms of the playoffs and an easy out, I found some quotes from Paul Maurice very interesting. He was asked about team fatigue from going deep in the playoffs two years in a row. Maurice said he wondered that very thing going into training camp, and especially knowing that Ekblad, Montour, and Bennett were all out to start the season. Maurice said first day he showed up to camp, he could see the hunger and determination from the team. First day of camp. He was worried, saying "Am I really going to have to rip into Barkov for not going full bore in a drill in September?" Never had to. The team was giving the type of effort in September and October that they needed to give....not dogging it. The effort was there and consistent all season.

This is something I have strongly wondered about the Penguins, because it often seems like in games the past 2 years, they aren't dropping into the extra gear or taking that extra hit to make a play, because the mentality is this game isn't important enough. Until they're all important and you've run out of time.

I think the main thing is the core 3 are old in NHL standards and they have won 3 cups. Their bodies don't do what they used to do and the drive to work that much harder isn't there all season. They've achieved everything there is to in the sport. That doesn't mean that the team can't succeed though. They just need to build out a deeper, more skilled, younger, hungrier team around Sid/Geno etc. Depth wins championships.

[lemieuxReturns]

If I am Jake's agent, I am waiting until Konecny signs this summer:
https://www.thefourthperiod.com/dimarco ... t-it-means

Jake is in line to get 10M+

Good for him, no idea how Carolina will keep him though.

[Puck-Lurker]

If I am Jake's agent, I am waiting until Konecny signs this summer:
https://www.thefourthperiod.com/dimarco ... t-it-means

Jake is in line to get 10M+

Good for him, no idea how Carolina will keep him though.

Does Jake want 10M or a shot at a cup? He will get one of the two and is worth either