2024-2025 Season Random Penguins Fodder

[lemieuxReturns]

Still under contract after this season:
Karlsson
Letang
Graves
Aho
St Ivany
Pickering
Kral
Pieniniemi
Brunicke
Belliveau

Resign Grzelcyk if he does alright and can be afforded. But that's okay as a starting point. Even without Pettersson

Or you give Pettersson a 2 year deal at a premium. Don't see why he'd take it though, he can get paid and get term.

Believe me, if Dubas traded away Jake he is also going to trade away MP. It would not make sense for him not to do so.

[FLPensFan]

Still under contract after this season:
Karlsson
Letang
Graves
Aho
St Ivany
Pickering
Kral
Pieniniemi
Brunicke
Belliveau

Resign Grzelcyk if he does alright and can be afforded. But that's okay as a starting point. Even without Pettersson

Or you give Pettersson a 2 year deal at a premium. Don't see why he'd take it though, he can get paid and get term.

Believe me, if Dubas traded away Jake he is also going to trade away MP. It would not make sense for him not to do so.

I think the longer it takes for a Pettersson deal to be discussed...keep your eye on Pickering. If Pickering is playing lights out in WBS, he should be the answer to replacing Pettersson the rest of this year and beyond.

If Pickering isn't playing well...keep your eye on Graves to see if he rebounds.
If Graves still doesn't rebound...there are a slew of LD available in the UFA market next summer. Provorov, Orlov, Chychrun, Gavrikov, Lindell, Theodore, Lindgren, McCabe.

LD is one of the most plentiful positions available. None of the above bodes well for Pettersson's long term outlook with the Penguins.

[KG]

[Antonio]

Petterson needs to be moved if no other reason than this team is in rebuild time and he is an asset that should generate a real return, which is what they need. Zero, ZERO reason to keep him and every reason to move him.

[Dynasty1970]

Petterson needs to be moved if no other reason than this team is in rebuild time and he is an asset that should generate a real return, which is what they need. Zero, ZERO reason to keep him and every reason to move him.

This team is next to last in the Power Rankings…..Unload anyone you can at this point. Let Crosby go…..it’s time to rebuild. A complete overhaul…..

[Antonio]

Agreed except I don't agree with moving Crosby. Honestly, move Petterson, Jarry, fire Sullivan into the sun, acquire more youth and picks and I'd be happy. Figure out a way to unload malkin and Letang also and I'd be ecstatic.

[FLPensFan]

Agreed except I don't agree with moving Crosby. Honestly, move Petterson, Jarry, fire Sullivan into the sun, acquire more youth and picks and I'd be happy. Figure out a way to unload malkin and Letang also and I'd be ecstatic.

I want to see how camp plays out, and I want to see how a few people look in the beginning of the season.
--Up front, we need to see if by the end of this season, McGroarty can be a top 6 player. If he can, and at least be a 20 goal, 50 point player, that helps the team on the rebuild front big time.
--Similar take on DOC. He's a UFA after this season. Does he take the next step and become a 20 goal guy playing in the top 6? Does McGroarty force him to the 3rd line, and if so, what type of numbers does he put up there? Contract year for DOC, and may decide if he stays and they pay him a few million or they move him.
--Rust loses his trade protection this summer. I want to see how he looks, as well as Rakell. Potentially move one of them this summer.
--For having an ***-load of bottom 6ers, there are some young guys shining right now. Let's see how they do in camp, but, with Eller, Lizotte, and Beauvillier UFAs at seasons end, I could see those guys being moved, and ready for Ponomarev and Broz to step in end of this year or next season.

2025 season

McGroarty-Crosby-Rust
Bunting-Malkin-FreeAgent
Ponomarev-Broz-Puustinen
Lizotte-Glass-Puljujarvi
x-Poulin

I feel that could actually be pretty solid lineup depending on who fills in on RW. Throw some money at Boeser on the UFA market, or make a trade.

On defense...
--Need to see if Graves rebound or if they are going to need to find a creative way to move him.
--Need to see if Karlsson is able to do more this year, otherwise I'd be looking to move on from him.
--Move Pettersson, and get an NHL ready high-end 2C prospect...even if we have to throw in a pick or another prospect.

2025 defense:
Pickering-Letang
Graves-Karlsson
Ludvig-St.Ivany
x-Belliveau, Aho

Goalie
--Move Jarry if you can.
--Promote Blomqvist
--If Murashov succeeds in AHL, potentially have Blomqvist-Murashov tandem in 2026-2027 season.

The biggest key to accelerating the rebuild is finding a top 6 center and/or #1 defenseman via trade. 1C, 2C, and 1D are the 3 hardest positions to fill. If you can get one by not waiting out lottery picks, the rebuild will be accelerated. Look at Florida. Barkov is their #1 C, they were able to acquire a youngish Bennett via trade, their 3C was a 12th overall pick. They survived with Ekblad as their #1 d-man, even though he has struggled. I think 1C and 2C are even more important, because we've seen a good defense by committee, with good depth, can survive without a true #1 d-man.

[FLPensFan]

Was reading on Kingerski's site that, reportedly, Kevin Lebanc wanted to sign with the Penguins this summer to restart his career. 28 years old RH winger, scored 17 goals and 56 points back in 18-19 season, but has fallen off each year since then. It seems as soon as David Quinn signed on as an assistant, Pittsburgh was no longer under consideration. He's now close to signing a PTO with NJ.

[Puck-Lurker]

Petterson needs to be moved if no other reason than this team is in rebuild time and he is an asset that should generate a real return, which is what they need. Zero, ZERO reason to keep him and every reason to move him.

This team is next to last in the Power Rankings…..Unload anyone you can at this point. Let Crosby go…..it’s time to rebuild. A complete overhaul…..

What if he doesn't want to go? I'd never trade Sid unless it was his idea. Then you facilitate a trade. When he resigns, a full NMC for the entire term gets attached.

There's about 28 other legit hockey teams to maybe trade him to, if he wanted.

By all accounts, he doesn't want to, so let's give him what he does want.


Any contract discussions for Pettersson will be after Crosby signs. Perhaps he will get signed to something like a 5 year deal with some good money, some kind of NTC for however long Crosby signs. I dunno. I'd be okay flipping Pettersson for more stuff at some point.

[Antonio]

Obviously I've already said my piece on what I think about Petterson needing to be dealt. That being said, despite frequently being angry over what I (and often many other "just fans") perceive as stupid moves, signings, actions by the organization and it's leadership (and sadly, often being right), I just have to freely admit how **** wrong I was over the Petterson signing. I thought that was a terrible idea and stupid contract at the time (and for the first year, thought I had been proven right) but boy was I off the mark. That turned out to be a fantastic contract and I not only ate a giant plate of crow on that, but I had to go to purge and eat a second plateful. If they could move him for a 1st somehow, I'd be ecstatic. Although, I will standby my current belief that re-signing him (other than to move him) would be a Grade A moron move.

[FLPensFan]

Injury report on Evander Kane as Oilers camp opens...two hernia and two torn abdominal muscles.

[FLPensFan]

Some rule changes in the NHL this year:

--Coaches challenge can now be used to overturn a delay of game (puck over glass) penalty. Can only be used to remove the call, cannot be used to challenge a call that was missed (went out of play over glass and not called by refs). Losing the coaches challenge on this results in a 2nd penalty (initial delay of game, plus another 2 minute penalty for losing the challenge).

--Defensive zone teams cannot make a line change if they are ruled to have accidentally knocked the net off. This includes the goalie.

--After an icing, the offensive faceoff player gets a warning for a first faceoff violation (previously, I think only the defensive player got a warning). The player is not removed from the circle. A 2nd violation causes a bench minor penalty to be called.

--Teams will now get one warning about players sitting on the boards with their skates in play (hanging over the boards) waiting for a line change. If the warned team commits the issue again, it will be a bench minor penalty.

--Final rule change...if a goalie leaves the ice for a medical issue, medical evaluation, the replacement goalie will now be allowed a brief warm up period.

[FLPensFan]

Rob Rossi directly asked Letang if he asked for a trade:

“People were talking about that?” Letang said while laughing Wednesday, the opening day of Penguins training camp at UPMC Lemieux Sports Complex.

“They didn’t talk to me.”

Asked directly if he requested a trade, as had been repeatedly discussed on Pittsburgh sports talk radio, Letang told The Athletic, “No, I did not.”

[BigMcK]

Rob Rossi directly asked Letang if he asked for a trade:

“People were talking about that?” Letang said while laughing Wednesday, the opening day of Penguins training camp at UPMC Lemieux Sports Complex.

“They didn’t talk to me.”

Asked directly if he requested a trade, as had been repeatedly discussed on Pittsburgh sports talk radio, Letang told The Athletic, “No, I did not.”

If Letang did request a trade, curious what the return would be? 1st round and prospects; 1st round and other picks; (fill in the blanks)?

[Antonio]

If letang would net a first, I'd beg him to accept it. No chance i don't think though, not with that contract.

[FLPensFan]

If letang would net a first, I'd beg him to accept it. No chance i don't think though, not with that contract.

I don't think there is anything wrong with his contract. He's got 4 years left at 6.1M (including this year)
--Letang was 18th in scoring by defensemen last year.
--->9 of the defensemen finishing above him were in their 20s.
--->Only 4 defensemen finishing above him were paid less than Letang; Of those 4, 2 of them are young guys due for big raises (Bouchard, Dobson)
--->9 of the defensemen above him were paid 8M AAV or more.

Bottom line, for his age, Letang is still producing at a high level and relatively low cost compared to those around him. Defensive impact much harder to measure, especially when the team as a whole struggled to score goals (we finished 18th), which hurts Letangs GF%.

[BigMcK]

If letang would net a first, I'd beg him to accept it. No chance i don't think though, not with that contract.

I don't think there is anything wrong with his contract. He's got 4 years left at 6.1M (including this year)
--Letang was 18th in scoring by defensemen last year.
--->9 of the defensemen finishing above him were in their 20s.
--->Only 4 defensemen finishing above him were paid less than Letang; Of those 4, 2 of them are young guys due for big raises (Bouchard, Dobson)
--->9 of the defensemen above him were paid 8M AAV or more.

Bottom line, for his age, Letang is still producing at a high level and relatively low cost compared to those around him. Defensive impact much harder to measure, especially when the team as a whole struggled to score goals (we finished 18th), which hurts Letangs GF%.

Impressive numbers on paper for sure. I think where he fails in general conversation is the eye test -- you see him play and it's hard not to yell at the TV when he drifts into the neutral zone leaving his position vacant, and he doesn't possess the afterburner speed to catch up when the puck heads the other way.

So, I do wonder what the return would be in a trade?

[dark_forces]

If letang would net a first, I'd beg him to accept it. No chance i don't think though, not with that contract.

I don't think there is anything wrong with his contract. He's got 4 years left at 6.1M (including this year)
--Letang was 18th in scoring by defensemen last year.
--->9 of the defensemen finishing above him were in their 20s.
--->Only 4 defensemen finishing above him were paid less than Letang; Of those 4, 2 of them are young guys due for big raises (Bouchard, Dobson)
--->9 of the defensemen above him were paid 8M AAV or more.

Bottom line, for his age, Letang is still producing at a high level and relatively low cost compared to those around him. Defensive impact much harder to measure, especially when the team as a whole struggled to score goals (we finished 18th), which hurts Letangs GF%.

Impressive numbers on paper for sure. I think where he fails in general conversation is the eye test -- you see him play and it's hard not to yell at the TV when he drifts into the neutral zone leaving his position vacant, and he doesn't possess the afterburner speed to catch up when the puck heads the other way.

So, I do wonder what the return would be in a trade?

Letang is the least of our problems. Another factor on the plus side—his ice time and prime situational opportunities decreased with the arrival of Karlsson, and he had a new defensive partner most nights who was not playing well in Graves.
Given all of those things, finishing 18th in scoring among defensemen is that much more of a feat. I think we'll see a strong season from him.

[FLPensFan]

If letang would net a first, I'd beg him to accept it. No chance i don't think though, not with that contract.

I don't think there is anything wrong with his contract. He's got 4 years left at 6.1M (including this year)
--Letang was 18th in scoring by defensemen last year.
--->9 of the defensemen finishing above him were in their 20s.
--->Only 4 defensemen finishing above him were paid less than Letang; Of those 4, 2 of them are young guys due for big raises (Bouchard, Dobson)
--->9 of the defensemen above him were paid 8M AAV or more.

Bottom line, for his age, Letang is still producing at a high level and relatively low cost compared to those around him. Defensive impact much harder to measure, especially when the team as a whole struggled to score goals (we finished 18th), which hurts Letangs GF%.

Impressive numbers on paper for sure. I think where he fails in general conversation is the eye test -- you see him play and it's hard not to yell at the TV when he drifts into the neutral zone leaving his position vacant, and he doesn't possess the afterburner speed to catch up when the puck heads the other way.

So, I do wonder what the return would be in a trade?

I'm willing to bet for all the bonehead plays he makes, loss of speed, being out of position, that Letang has a net positive impact on team outcomes. Yes, we've all seen him cost us some games, too. But I always go back to when people were criticizing Letang maybe 7-8 years ago, and somebody asked Brent Burns about it at the all-star game, and he talked about how it truly is a game of inches, and how the elite level players will try and do stuff that average or above average players won't. When watching on TV, a pass or breakout play that looks ordinary when it works may not be all that ordinary, and it's easier to pick out the mistakes when they miss by that fraction of an inch versus wowing over the seemingly routine play that really wasn't routine at all.

[Puck-Lurker]

Letang is a good offensive defenceman on a team friendly deal. I don't want to trade him, even though I get frustrated when his plays don't work and cost us.

If he does get traded, I'll take two 1st rounders, or a 1st and a top prospect. That is to say, don't trade Letang, or Geno for that matter, for similar reasons.

[Antonio]

If letang would net a first, I'd beg him to accept it. No chance i don't think though, not with that contract.

I don't think there is anything wrong with his contract. He's got 4 years left at 6.1M (including this year)
--Letang was 18th in scoring by defensemen last year.
--->9 of the defensemen finishing above him were in their 20s.
--->Only 4 defensemen finishing above him were paid less than Letang; Of those 4, 2 of them are young guys due for big raises (Bouchard, Dobson)
--->9 of the defensemen above him were paid 8M AAV or more.

Bottom line, for his age, Letang is still producing at a high level and relatively low cost compared to those around him. Defensive impact much harder to measure, especially when the team as a whole struggled to score goals (we finished 18th), which hurts Letangs GF%.

Let's seriously think about paying him 6.1m for FOUR more years. He's decent right now and we're talking almost another half a decade. He'll be 41 at the end of that deal. And yes, outside of the raw numbers, watching him shows that, for lack of a better term, he's a moron. And as his physical talent erodes (which it already has), he will be a greater negative and certainly 4 years is a long time to watch that process. I stand by what I said. If he netted a first, I'd prostrate myself before him and weep to get him to accept the trade. Don't see anyone taking it though, because I wager that most teams would see it like me... Over 6 million for a guy who is in the prime of decline at 37-41? Nah, pass.

[Posterboy]

At the risk of incurring the board's wrath for recreating Miller to PIT... https://www.tsn.ca/video/hayes-i-did-no ... %7E2996918

Playing connect the dots just for fun, you've got Rutherford, Allvin, Tocchet and more ex-Pens organ-eye-za-tion, Jarry from there. See if this gets traction like Miller.

In all seriousness, if VAN thinks last year wasn't an aberration and they're at the point of contending they may have a decision to make. Demko's world class but if he can't get back to form or get back at all do they start looking? Most of what I've read has made it sound like they're not too concerned but the TSN piece kind of makes me wonder. Silovs is unproven and dealing with his own injury issues. I don't know anything more about their depth in net beyond that.

If it gets a couple of months into the season and Blomqvist and/or Murashov look legit, is there any realistic scenario Jarry or Nedeljkovic might be an option? If Demko went on LTIR does that give them cap space? I think he's $5 million for the next 2 years.

[FLPensFan]

At the risk of incurring the board's wrath for recreating Miller to PIT... https://www.tsn.ca/video/hayes-i-did-no ... %7E2996918

Playing connect the dots just for fun, you've got Rutherford, Allvin, Tocchet and more ex-Pens organ-eye-za-tion, Jarry from there. See if this gets traction like Miller.

In all seriousness, if VAN thinks last year wasn't an aberration and they're at the point of contending they may have a decision to make. Demko's world class but if he can't get back to form or get back at all do they start looking? Most of what I've read has made it sound like they're not too concerned but the TSN piece kind of makes me wonder. Silovs is unproven and dealing with his own injury issues. I don't know anything more about their depth in net beyond that.

If it gets a couple of months into the season and Blomqvist and/or Murashov look legit, is there any realistic scenario Jarry or Nedeljkovic might be an option? If Demko went on LTIR does that give them cap space? I think he's $5 million for the next 2 years.

I've thought about this some. I think Vancouver fans are so hung up on Demko being a top 5-10 goalie talent, that they are missing the bigger picture...which is, it seems like Vancouver has a really strong window right now to compete, with more reinforcements a year or two away (Lekkerimaki, Wilander, Raty, etc). I'd sure hate to have a stellar team be sunk by below average goaltending.

In the past, I was saying something like Jarry and a 2nd for Demko and a 3rd, but, the more I think about it, it doesn't make much sense for the Penguins. What they really should look at is a 3 team trade, where Vancouver gets Jarry, say Chicago gets Demko, and Pittsburgh gets...something. I'd love for them to get Kurashev, but that's unlikely. Maybe just a 2nd and a 3rd for Jarry? I really don't have a good handle on what the return for everyone would be

To VAN: Jarry, CHI 2026 2nd round
To CHI: Demko, PIT 2025 3rd round
To PIT: Kurashev

I think the only way Chicago would even consider moving Kurashev was if Frank Nazar forced his way onto the team, or if Lukas Reichel played lights out to force his way further up the lineup than the bottom 6.

[FLPensFan]

From Athletic article yesterday on Guentzel:

Agent Ben Hankinson said there were times they thought Guentzel would remain with the Penguins, and they came “somewhat close” to a deal last summer. (last summer being 2023 summer)

“I think with (Guentzel’s) injury before last season, and (Dubas) was trying to decide which way they were going,” Hankinson said on the “Fellowship of the Rink” podcast. “If he was 100 percent healthy, maybe he gets signed. Jake wanted to re-sign in Pittsburgh. Dubas wanted Jake to sign, he knew how valuable he was. Jake is loyal, a great hockey player, loves (Sidney) Crosby, loves the Hall of Fame cast there. Wanted to get a deal done. We were somewhat close. But he was hurt and I think that was a reason it didn’t get done. They wanted to wait and see what was going to happen.

“Pittsburgh didn’t make enough of a statement this year to show everyone involved — most importantly probably Dubas — that they were ready to pay Jake what he’s going to get in free agency. And that was the right move for that team at the time. Were they going into rebuilding? Was Sid going to be there? It was such a tough dynamic. Dubas did a good job under some tough, uncertain times.”

Hankinson also said Guentzel "almost" re-signed with Carolina, but, it took too long. Hankinson said he was pretty sure Guentzel was going to re-sign there. But once they got past the draft with no deal, other things start happening around the league, teams start making moves, cap space opens up (Stamkos not coming back), and players get more convinced to see what is out there in free agency.

[Puck-Lurker]

That all seems on point.

Guentzel resigning wasn't going to get done, the way we were trending. At the time that's 100% the right call.

He makes 9Mx7, locked up until the age of 36. Four years NMC, then a 10 team NTC for three years.

Housing 9M would exceed Crosby's salary. Let's say he would have signed at 8.5M instead, because of past good times. You're still dealing with a significant amount of term on a high end player / high cap space player. But he's not a 1C or 2C and needs one to be effective. Karlsson's contract is a whale, but only for a few more years.

Jake isn't an aging star like Malkin or Letang. He's 29 and at peak performance. No reason for him to take some contract with 6.5M aav.

I don't see any way you can rebuild or retool and sign Guentzel to say 8.5Mx7 with some (Santa)Clausing attached. The Jake window was shut, we got some mid level prospects back along with Bunting for helping Carolina lose in round 2. That's business and just the way it is.

Moneyballing... Bunting+Grzelcyk+Lizotte = 8.5M. That's what we have room for. We may be better off with the sum of parts, than with the one Peña. I mean Guentzel.