Eller traded back to the Caps

[pfim]

Interesting looking over the Pens' draft history:
https://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/tea ... 07475.html

Looks like I picked the wrong week to stop sniffing glue. Thanks Admin.

[FLPensFan]

Interesting looking over the Pens' draft history:
https://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/tea ... 07475.html

It's not pretty, but let's concentrate just on Dubas's 2 years right now:

2023
--Too early to tell on Yager. He looks like he could be a very good player, but not sure if he will be an NHL center. He's still probably 2 years away from making an impact at the NHL level.
--Pieniniemi and Ilyin I hear positive things. Still too early. I thought Pieniniemi would be at WBS this year.
--IIRC, Foster had a decent showing at dev camp or rookie camp, and Kangas has some upside.
--Too soon on the overall draft class, but it looks like there can be some ok players here.

2024
--Brunicke looks like a 2nd round steal that could be in the NHL as soon as next year
--Howe looked good over the summer. Still too early, but could be a good pick.
--I'm not overly high on the rest of this pick draft, but Harding I think had a good showing this summer.

Now, go back and look at who I just spoke highly of...our 1st, two 2nds, a 3rd, plus a 5th, 6th and 7th. If Dubas can hit on more of the top end picks, this team will be in good shape. But they need 1 or 2 of those high end picks to get a high end center or 1st pairing d-man.

[Cow_Master66]

Interesting looking over the Pens' draft history:
https://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/tea ... 07475.html

It's not pretty, but let's concentrate just on Dubas's 2 years right now:

2023
--Too early to tell on Yager. He looks like he could be a very good player, but not sure if he will be an NHL center. He's still probably 2 years away from making an impact at the NHL level.
--Pieniniemi and Ilyin I hear positive things. Still too early. I thought Pieniniemi would be at WBS this year.
--IIRC, Foster had a decent showing at dev camp or rookie camp, and Kangas has some upside.
--Too soon on the overall draft class, but it looks like there can be some ok players here.

2024
--Brunicke looks like a 2nd round steal that could be in the NHL as soon as next year
--Howe looked good over the summer. Still too early, but could be a good pick.
--I'm not overly high on the rest of this pick draft, but Harding I think had a good showing this summer.

Now, go back and look at who I just spoke highly of...our 1st, two 2nds, a 3rd, plus a 5th, 6th and 7th. If Dubas can hit on more of the top end picks, this team will be in good shape. But they need 1 or 2 of those high end picks to get a high end center or 1st pairing d-man.

This is why they need to keep stockpiling picks. They won't all be hits, but the more swings you get, the better....Even with some moderate success above, you're still looking at 4-5 years just to get back to relevance, which is why nobody on this team should be untouchable.

[Puck-Lurker]

Interesting looking over the Pens' draft history:
https://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/tea ... 07475.html

Looks like I picked the wrong week to stop sniffing glue. Thanks Admin.

The 5 last 3rd rounders Pens hit on.

2013: Jake Guentzel
2012: Matt Murray, Oskar Sundqvist
2010: Bryan Rust
2007: Robert Bortuzzo

Since Guentzel, we drafted Connor Hall (2016), Clayton Phillips (2017), Nathan Légaré (2018), Calle Clang (2019) and Emil Pieniniemi (2023). To be fair, jury's still out on Pieniniemi (and I need to pay more attention to him apparently ) May amount to 0/5 since 2014.


As a whole, it's not an inspiring look at our picks. Don't expect any of the lower picks to amount to anything, except Murashov. Talent's there. Our recent first and second rounders look fine to me. Pickering, (Yager-->RMG), Brunicke, Howe, Broz, Blomqvist. If I had to pick any of that group to not make it, I'd say Howe.

[Pruezy11881]

FYI Pieniniemi is looking pretty damn good in the O right now. 20 points in 19 games for Kingston. 5th leading scorer on the team with 2G and 11A on the PP. Kingston currently has 5th best record (2nd in the Eastern Conference), 3rd ranked PP, and 2nd ranked PK in the O.

[pekkasteele]

Hopefully this is to clear cap space so that we can take on a really bad contract ( that expires next summer) and some good pics for Jarry ... one can hope

[100565]

Interesting looking over the Pens' draft history:
https://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/tea ... 07475.html

Looks like I picked the wrong week to stop sniffing glue. Thanks Admin.

The 5 last 3rd rounders Pens hit on.

2013: Jake Guentzel
2012: Matt Murray, Oskar Sundqvist
2010: Bryan Rust
2007: Robert Bortuzzo

Since Guentzel, we drafted Connor Hall (2016), Clayton Phillips (2017), Nathan Légaré (2018), Calle Clang (2019) and Emil Pieniniemi (2023). To be fair, jury's still out on Pieniniemi (and I need to pay more attention to him apparently ) May amount to 0/5 since 2014.


As a whole, it's not an inspiring look at our picks. Don't expect any of the lower picks to amount to anything, except Murashov. Talent's there. Our recent first and second rounders look fine to me. Pickering, (Yager-->RMG), Brunicke, Howe, Broz, Blomqvist. If I had to pick any of that group to not make it, I'd say Howe.

Third round picks rarely make an impact in NHL. Last year, only 30 players drafted in third round had more than 25 points in the NHL. Only 20 players drafted in third round had more than 40 points, including Reily Smith, Letang, Rust, and Guentzel.

0/5 is somewhat typical.

[pfim]

From 2016-2019, only 350 NHL games played amongst the draft picks. And only 76 of those came in a Penguins' sweater. My Lord...

[Puck-Lurker]

From 2016-2019, only 350 NHL games played amongst the draft picks. And only 76 of those came in a Penguins' sweater. My Lord...

Yeah, that's a big black hole right there

[FLPensFan]

Interesting looking over the Pens' draft history:
https://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/tea ... 07475.html

Looks like I picked the wrong week to stop sniffing glue. Thanks Admin.

The 5 last 3rd rounders Pens hit on.

2013: Jake Guentzel
2012: Matt Murray, Oskar Sundqvist
2010: Bryan Rust
2007: Robert Bortuzzo

Since Guentzel, we drafted Connor Hall (2016), Clayton Phillips (2017), Nathan Légaré (2018), Calle Clang (2019) and Emil Pieniniemi (2023). To be fair, jury's still out on Pieniniemi (and I need to pay more attention to him apparently ) May amount to 0/5 since 2014.


As a whole, it's not an inspiring look at our picks. Don't expect any of the lower picks to amount to anything, except Murashov. Talent's there. Our recent first and second rounders look fine to me. Pickering, (Yager-->RMG), Brunicke, Howe, Broz, Blomqvist. If I had to pick any of that group to not make it, I'd say Howe.

Third round picks rarely make an impact in NHL. Last year, only 30 players drafted in third round had more than 25 points in the NHL. Only 20 players drafted in third round had more than 40 points, including Reily Smith, Letang, Rust, and Guentzel.

0/5 is somewhat typical.

To expand on the 3rd rounders a little more, league-wide:
--There isn't a single 3rd round pick drafted in 2024, 2023, or 2022 that has played a single NHL game. There are only 8 total 2nd round picks from those 3 years to play NHL games, and 7 of the 8 are from the 2022 draft. So, it takes awhile to realize those gains.

Looking at 2021 back to 2018 NHL drafts (4 drafts):
---2021, 3 third round picks have played NHL games. The 3 of them have a combined 15 total NHL games.
---2020, only 12 of 31 third round picks have played NHL games. Those 12 players have played a combined 280 NHL games, or an average of 23 games each. Only 2 played more than 50 games (Alex Laferriere and Wyatt Kaiser).
--2019, only 12 of 31 third round picks have played NHL games. Those 12 players have played a combined 471 NHL games, or an average of 39 games each. Only 3 have played more than 50 games (Aliaksei Protas, Zac Jones, Pavel Dorofeyev)
--2018, only 16 of 31 third round picks have played NHL games. Those 16 players have played a combined 841 NHL games, or an average of 52 games each. Only 5 have played more than 50 games (Dostal, Lauko, McBain, Jordan Harris, Connor Dewar)

So, the summary and conclusion I draw from this is:
--Over 4 year span, 43 out of 125 (34.4%) have played an NHL game. Only 10 of 125 (12.5%) have played more than 50 NHL games.
--If 90% of players are drafted when they are 18, then most 3rd round picks don't break into the league until they are closer to 24 years of age.
--Out of all 43 of those players, only Vegas's Pavel Dorofeyev averages a half point per game or better production, 82 games, 44 total points.
--A quick look at the 4th round over that 4 year span, and only 25 of 125 picks ever played an NHL game (20%). Only 8 of 125 picks (6.4%) played more than 50 NHL games.

3rd round picks can be useful to fill out your depth, but you aren't very likely to find impact players there. If I look at all the 3rd round picks drafted back to 2013, the only ones that stand out as better than bottom 6 players in the whole league are Jake Guentzel, Adam Fox, Anthony Cirelli, Brayden Point, Pavel Buchnevich, Anthony Duclair, Carter Verhaeghe, and Oliver Bjorkstrand. 8 total guys across the whole league that I would consider impact 3rd round picks. 8 guys across 9 draft years (12 draft years if you want to go all the way up to present day).

[Daniel]

Interesting looking over the Pens' draft history:
https://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/tea ... 07475.html

Looks like I picked the wrong week to stop sniffing glue. Thanks Admin.

The 5 last 3rd rounders Pens hit on.

2013: Jake Guentzel
2012: Matt Murray, Oskar Sundqvist
2010: Bryan Rust
2007: Robert Bortuzzo

Since Guentzel, we drafted Connor Hall (2016), Clayton Phillips (2017), Nathan Légaré (2018), Calle Clang (2019) and Emil Pieniniemi (2023). To be fair, jury's still out on Pieniniemi (and I need to pay more attention to him apparently ) May amount to 0/5 since 2014.


As a whole, it's not an inspiring look at our picks. Don't expect any of the lower picks to amount to anything, except Murashov. Talent's there. Our recent first and second rounders look fine to me. Pickering, (Yager-->RMG), Brunicke, Howe, Broz, Blomqvist. If I had to pick any of that group to not make it, I'd say Howe.

Third round picks rarely make an impact in NHL. Last year, only 30 players drafted in third round had more than 25 points in the NHL. Only 20 players drafted in third round had more than 40 points, including Reily Smith, Letang, Rust, and Guentzel.

0/5 is somewhat typical.

To expand on the 3rd rounders a little more, league-wide:
--There isn't a single 3rd round pick drafted in 2024, 2023, or 2022 that has played a single NHL game. There are only 8 total 2nd round picks from those 3 years to play NHL games, and 7 of the 8 are from the 2022 draft. So, it takes awhile to realize those gains.

Looking at 2021 back to 2018 NHL drafts (4 drafts):
---2021, 3 third round picks have played NHL games. The 3 of them have a combined 15 total NHL games.
---2020, only 12 of 31 third round picks have played NHL games. Those 12 players have played a combined 280 NHL games, or an average of 23 games each. Only 2 played more than 50 games (Alex Laferriere and Wyatt Kaiser).
--2019, only 12 of 31 third round picks have played NHL games. Those 12 players have played a combined 471 NHL games, or an average of 39 games each. Only 3 have played more than 50 games (Aliaksei Protas, Zac Jones, Pavel Dorofeyev)
--2018, only 16 of 31 third round picks have played NHL games. Those 16 players have played a combined 841 NHL games, or an average of 52 games each. Only 5 have played more than 50 games (Dostal, Lauko, McBain, Jordan Harris, Connor Dewar)

So, the summary and conclusion I draw from this is:
--Over 4 year span, 43 out of 125 (34.4%) have played an NHL game. Only 10 of 125 (12.5%) have played more than 50 NHL games.
--If 90% of players are drafted when they are 18, then most 3rd round picks don't break into the league until they are closer to 24 years of age.
--Out of all 43 of those players, only Vegas's Pavel Dorofeyev averages a half point per game or better production, 82 games, 44 total points.
--A quick look at the 4th round over that 4 year span, and only 25 of 125 picks ever played an NHL game (20%). Only 8 of 125 picks (6.4%) played more than 50 NHL games.

3rd round picks can be useful to fill out your depth, but you aren't very likely to find impact players there. If I look at all the 3rd round picks drafted back to 2013, the only ones that stand out as better than bottom 6 players in the whole league are Jake Guentzel, Adam Fox, Anthony Cirelli, Brayden Point, Pavel Buchnevich, Anthony Duclair, Carter Verhaeghe, and Oliver Bjorkstrand. 8 total guys across the whole league that I would consider impact 3rd round picks. 8 guys across 9 draft years (12 draft years if you want to go all the way up to present day).

So pretty much equal value for Lars Eller?

[FLPensFan]

Looks like I picked the wrong week to stop sniffing glue. Thanks Admin.

The 5 last 3rd rounders Pens hit on.

2013: Jake Guentzel
2012: Matt Murray, Oskar Sundqvist
2010: Bryan Rust
2007: Robert Bortuzzo

Since Guentzel, we drafted Connor Hall (2016), Clayton Phillips (2017), Nathan Légaré (2018), Calle Clang (2019) and Emil Pieniniemi (2023). To be fair, jury's still out on Pieniniemi (and I need to pay more attention to him apparently ) May amount to 0/5 since 2014.


As a whole, it's not an inspiring look at our picks. Don't expect any of the lower picks to amount to anything, except Murashov. Talent's there. Our recent first and second rounders look fine to me. Pickering, (Yager-->RMG), Brunicke, Howe, Broz, Blomqvist. If I had to pick any of that group to not make it, I'd say Howe.

Third round picks rarely make an impact in NHL. Last year, only 30 players drafted in third round had more than 25 points in the NHL. Only 20 players drafted in third round had more than 40 points, including Reily Smith, Letang, Rust, and Guentzel.

0/5 is somewhat typical.

To expand on the 3rd rounders a little more, league-wide:
--There isn't a single 3rd round pick drafted in 2024, 2023, or 2022 that has played a single NHL game. There are only 8 total 2nd round picks from those 3 years to play NHL games, and 7 of the 8 are from the 2022 draft. So, it takes awhile to realize those gains.

Looking at 2021 back to 2018 NHL drafts (4 drafts):
---2021, 3 third round picks have played NHL games. The 3 of them have a combined 15 total NHL games.
---2020, only 12 of 31 third round picks have played NHL games. Those 12 players have played a combined 280 NHL games, or an average of 23 games each. Only 2 played more than 50 games (Alex Laferriere and Wyatt Kaiser).
--2019, only 12 of 31 third round picks have played NHL games. Those 12 players have played a combined 471 NHL games, or an average of 39 games each. Only 3 have played more than 50 games (Aliaksei Protas, Zac Jones, Pavel Dorofeyev)
--2018, only 16 of 31 third round picks have played NHL games. Those 16 players have played a combined 841 NHL games, or an average of 52 games each. Only 5 have played more than 50 games (Dostal, Lauko, McBain, Jordan Harris, Connor Dewar)

So, the summary and conclusion I draw from this is:
--Over 4 year span, 43 out of 125 (34.4%) have played an NHL game. Only 10 of 125 (12.5%) have played more than 50 NHL games.
--If 90% of players are drafted when they are 18, then most 3rd round picks don't break into the league until they are closer to 24 years of age.
--Out of all 43 of those players, only Vegas's Pavel Dorofeyev averages a half point per game or better production, 82 games, 44 total points.
--A quick look at the 4th round over that 4 year span, and only 25 of 125 picks ever played an NHL game (20%). Only 8 of 125 picks (6.4%) played more than 50 NHL games.

3rd round picks can be useful to fill out your depth, but you aren't very likely to find impact players there. If I look at all the 3rd round picks drafted back to 2013, the only ones that stand out as better than bottom 6 players in the whole league are Jake Guentzel, Adam Fox, Anthony Cirelli, Brayden Point, Pavel Buchnevich, Anthony Duclair, Carter Verhaeghe, and Oliver Bjorkstrand. 8 total guys across the whole league that I would consider impact 3rd round picks. 8 guys across 9 draft years (12 draft years if you want to go all the way up to present day).

So pretty much equal value for Lars Eller?

Yep. I think it's fair. When he was acquired by Colorado at the trade deadline in 2023, he fetched a 2nd. MAYBE he could have fetched a 2nd at the trade deadline if 3Cs were in demand and there was short supply.

I'm fine with the return.

[brwi]

Yep. I think it's fair. When he was acquired by Colorado at the trade deadline in 2023, he fetched a 2nd. MAYBE he could have fetched a 2nd at the trade deadline if 3Cs were in demand and there was short supply.

I'm fine with the return.

Eller turns 36 in May, pending UFA, and has 1 point(assist) in his last 10 games. Dubas might have asked for a 2nd at the TDL last spring, but found no takers and holding on to Eller and hoping no injuries and an upturn in production was too risky.

[Dynasty1970]

Interesting looking over the Pens' draft history:
https://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/tea ... 07475.html

Looks like I picked the wrong week to stop sniffing glue. Thanks Admin.

The 5 last 3rd rounders Pens hit on.

2013: Jake Guentzel
2012: Matt Murray, Oskar Sundqvist
2010: Bryan Rust
2007: Robert Bortuzzo

Since Guentzel, we drafted Connor Hall (2016), Clayton Phillips (2017), Nathan Légaré (2018), Calle Clang (2019) and Emil Pieniniemi (2023). To be fair, jury's still out on Pieniniemi (and I need to pay more attention to him apparently ) May amount to 0/5 since 2014.


As a whole, it's not an inspiring look at our picks. Don't expect any of the lower picks to amount to anything, except Murashov. Talent's there. Our recent first and second rounders look fine to me. Pickering, (Yager-->RMG), Brunicke, Howe, Broz, Blomqvist. If I had to pick any of that group to not make it, I'd say Howe.

Let's face it....Our scouts have sucked for a long time. I really think that us landing Jake and Rust were more along the lines of "Even a broken watch is correct twice a day"

[KG]

Friedman on his pod said the Pens did Eller a solid by trading him back to the Caps. Eller didn’t have any trade protection but he wanted to go back to Washington.

Classy move by KD for a class player in Eller.

[FLPensFan]

Friedman on his pod said the Pens did Eller a solid by trading him back to the Caps. Eller didn’t have any trade protection but he wanted to go back to Washington.

Classy move by KD for a class player in Eller.

From what I have read, I think it was more that Washington wanted him, not that KD tried to accommodate him. They way Dubas stated things, he laid out a price at the trade deadline last year of what he expected in return. As we got into the season, you had Lizotte coming back, they liked what they saw from their centers in WBS, and felt comfortable dealing Eller. But, the deal seemed to be driven by Washington being interested and finally meeting Dubas's price that he had set earlier in the year.

[Puck-Lurker]

Friedman on his pod said the Pens did Eller a solid by trading him back to the Caps. Eller didn’t have any trade protection but he wanted to go back to Washington.

Classy move by KD for a class player in Eller.

From what I have read, I think it was more that Washington wanted him, not that KD tried to accommodate him. They way Dubas stated things, he laid out a price at the trade deadline last year of what he expected in return. As we got into the season, you had Lizotte coming back, they liked what they saw from their centers in WBS, and felt comfortable dealing Eller. But, the deal seemed to be driven by Washington being interested and finally meeting Dubas's price that he had set earlier in the year.

Agreed, I don't think anyone was willing to pay Dubas' price. Say there was another team willing to pony up a 3rd and 5th.. I don't know.. Preds maybe. In that hypothetical case (and that's all it is) I could see Dubas sending Eller to Washington anyway.

Still, good on Eller to go somewhere he actually wanted to go. He was here briefly, but he was good with whatever was asked of him and whatever linemates he got saddled with from day to day.