The sad state of Pittsburgh sports franchises

[FLPensFan]

I decided to put myself through the agony of looking at the state of Pittsburgh sports teams in terms of making the playoffs and playoff wins, as far back as since the Penguins inception since that marked 2 important dates in sports history (1 formation of Penguins, 2 start of Super Bowl era). For purposes of this discussion, I'm counting a Steelers playoff victory as a "series" win to even it out with the other 2 sports where multiple games are played against the same team.

At present across the 3 Pittsburgh professional teams, the teams have gone 7 years without a playoff win from any of the 3 teams. During that span, the Penguins missed the playoffs twice, the Steelers missed the playoffs twice, and the Pirates...yeah, no playoffs all 7 years.

The last time things were this bad or worse in Pittsburgh sports was the 4 year period of 1985 to 1988, where no teams in that 4 year period even made the playoffs.

If you want to expand that, 1980 to 1990 was the decade of Pittsburgh misery. Across the 3 sports teams and those 11 seasons, there were 3 total series wins in that span. 2 by the Steelers (1984, 1989) and 1 by the Penguins (1989).

The Pirates have 1 series win in 45 F$%@#% YEARS!!! Besides the 2013 season, the last series win was the 1979 World Series champs years.

The difference between now and the 80s...the 80s, teams were just bad, small market, bad ownership, and rebuild after championships (Steelers).
Today, across all 3 teams, it seems to be more of complacency, profit taking, or the acceptance of just being mediocre.

[Fast B]

I decided to put myself through the agony of looking at the state of Pittsburgh sports teams in terms of making the playoffs and playoff wins, as far back as since the Penguins inception since that marked 2 important dates in sports history (1 formation of Penguins, 2 start of Super Bowl era). For purposes of this discussion, I'm counting a Steelers playoff victory as a "series" win to even it out with the other 2 sports where multiple games are played against the same team.

At present across the 3 Pittsburgh professional teams, the teams have gone 7 years without a playoff win from any of the 3 teams. During that span, the Penguins missed the playoffs twice, the Steelers missed the playoffs twice, and the Pirates...yeah, no playoffs all 7 years.

The last time things were this bad or worse in Pittsburgh sports was the 4 year period of 1985 to 1988, where no teams in that 4 year period even made the playoffs.

If you want to expand that, 1980 to 1990 was the decade of Pittsburgh misery. Across the 3 sports teams and those 11 seasons, there were 3 total series wins in that span. 2 by the Steelers (1984, 1989) and 1 by the Penguins (1989).

The Pirates have 1 series win in 45 F$%@#% YEARS!!! Besides the 2013 season, the last series win was the 1979 World Series champs years.

The difference between now and the 80s...the 80s, teams were just bad, small market, bad ownership, and rebuild after championships (Steelers).
Today, across all 3 teams, it seems to be more of complacency, profit taking, or the acceptance of just being mediocre.

Do you mean only the World Series here? I'm pretty sure the Pirates were famously in the NLCS from 90-92. As much as I hate to revisit that painful history, they did win multiple rounds to get there and it's the closest they've actually been to even making the World Series in my lifetime. (Not that they haven't sucked for most of the time anyway.)

[largegarlic]

I decided to put myself through the agony of looking at the state of Pittsburgh sports teams in terms of making the playoffs and playoff wins, as far back as since the Penguins inception since that marked 2 important dates in sports history (1 formation of Penguins, 2 start of Super Bowl era). For purposes of this discussion, I'm counting a Steelers playoff victory as a "series" win to even it out with the other 2 sports where multiple games are played against the same team.

At present across the 3 Pittsburgh professional teams, the teams have gone 7 years without a playoff win from any of the 3 teams. During that span, the Penguins missed the playoffs twice, the Steelers missed the playoffs twice, and the Pirates...yeah, no playoffs all 7 years.

The last time things were this bad or worse in Pittsburgh sports was the 4 year period of 1985 to 1988, where no teams in that 4 year period even made the playoffs.

If you want to expand that, 1980 to 1990 was the decade of Pittsburgh misery. Across the 3 sports teams and those 11 seasons, there were 3 total series wins in that span. 2 by the Steelers (1984, 1989) and 1 by the Penguins (1989).

The Pirates have 1 series win in 45 F$%@#% YEARS!!! Besides the 2013 season, the last series win was the 1979 World Series champs years.

The difference between now and the 80s...the 80s, teams were just bad, small market, bad ownership, and rebuild after championships (Steelers).
Today, across all 3 teams, it seems to be more of complacency, profit taking, or the acceptance of just being mediocre.

I still think the Pens right now are more like the 80s Steelers where they're rebuilding after a 10-12 year run as serious contenders. They're not calling it a rebuild, but I think Dubas clearly shifted into that mode last trade deadline. It's probably not as deep and quick a rebuild as we fans might like, but I'm still giving Dubas some time to make things work. Already, it feels like the first time in a long time that we have honest-to-goodness prospects in the system.

The Pirates just aren't relevant until they get new ownership.

The Steelers are actually in a pretty tricky spot, I think. Tomlin is a high floor/low ceiling sort of coach, and they have some legitimately good players, making it hard to just say, "blow it all up and rebuild." But it seems like to be real contenders, they need an elite QB and/or a coaching staff that can actually out scheme the better teams in the league. It's unlikely they can get an elite QB drafting at ~20 every year, and they seem unwilling to roll the dice on a new coach, who, to be fair, could end up being less successful than Tomlin.

[FLPensFan]

I decided to put myself through the agony of looking at the state of Pittsburgh sports teams in terms of making the playoffs and playoff wins, as far back as since the Penguins inception since that marked 2 important dates in sports history (1 formation of Penguins, 2 start of Super Bowl era). For purposes of this discussion, I'm counting a Steelers playoff victory as a "series" win to even it out with the other 2 sports where multiple games are played against the same team.

At present across the 3 Pittsburgh professional teams, the teams have gone 7 years without a playoff win from any of the 3 teams. During that span, the Penguins missed the playoffs twice, the Steelers missed the playoffs twice, and the Pirates...yeah, no playoffs all 7 years.

The last time things were this bad or worse in Pittsburgh sports was the 4 year period of 1985 to 1988, where no teams in that 4 year period even made the playoffs.

If you want to expand that, 1980 to 1990 was the decade of Pittsburgh misery. Across the 3 sports teams and those 11 seasons, there were 3 total series wins in that span. 2 by the Steelers (1984, 1989) and 1 by the Penguins (1989).

The Pirates have 1 series win in 45 F$%@#% YEARS!!! Besides the 2013 season, the last series win was the 1979 World Series champs years.

The difference between now and the 80s...the 80s, teams were just bad, small market, bad ownership, and rebuild after championships (Steelers).
Today, across all 3 teams, it seems to be more of complacency, profit taking, or the acceptance of just being mediocre.

Do you mean only the World Series here? I'm pretty sure the Pirates were famously in the NLCS from 90-92. As much as I hate to revisit that painful history, they did win multiple rounds to get there and it's the closest they've actually been to even making the World Series in my lifetime. (Not that they haven't sucked for most of the time anyway.)

The Pirates didn't win any playoff rounds in the 1990s. The NLDS only started in 1995. It was NLCS then World Series. Pirates lost to the Reds in 1990, and the Braves in 1991 and 1992. All of those occurred in the NLCS, when there were no rounds before the NLCS.

[pens_CT]

I decided to put myself through the agony of looking at the state of Pittsburgh sports teams in terms of making the playoffs and playoff wins, as far back as since the Penguins inception since that marked 2 important dates in sports history (1 formation of Penguins, 2 start of Super Bowl era). For purposes of this discussion, I'm counting a Steelers playoff victory as a "series" win to even it out with the other 2 sports where multiple games are played against the same team.

At present across the 3 Pittsburgh professional teams, the teams have gone 7 years without a playoff win from any of the 3 teams. During that span, the Penguins missed the playoffs twice, the Steelers missed the playoffs twice, and the Pirates...yeah, no playoffs all 7 years.

The last time things were this bad or worse in Pittsburgh sports was the 4 year period of 1985 to 1988, where no teams in that 4 year period even made the playoffs.

If you want to expand that, 1980 to 1990 was the decade of Pittsburgh misery. Across the 3 sports teams and those 11 seasons, there were 3 total series wins in that span. 2 by the Steelers (1984, 1989) and 1 by the Penguins (1989).

The Pirates have 1 series win in 45 F$%@#% YEARS!!! Besides the 2013 season, the last series win was the 1979 World Series champs years.

The difference between now and the 80s...the 80s, teams were just bad, small market, bad ownership, and rebuild after championships (Steelers).
Today, across all 3 teams, it seems to be more of complacency, profit taking, or the acceptance of just being mediocre.

I still think the Pens right now are more like the 80s Steelers where they're rebuilding after a 10-12 year run as serious contenders. They're not calling it a rebuild, but I think Dubas clearly shifted into that mode last trade deadline. It's probably not as deep and quick a rebuild as we fans might like, but I'm still giving Dubas some time to make things work. Already, it feels like the first time in a long time that we have honest-to-goodness prospects in the system.

The Pirates just aren't relevant until they get new ownership.

The Steelers are actually in a pretty tricky spot, I think. Tomlin is a high floor/low ceiling sort of coach, and they have some legitimately good players, making it hard to just say, "blow it all up and rebuild." But it seems like to be real contenders, they need an elite QB and/or a coaching staff that can actually out scheme the better teams in the league. It's unlikely they can get an elite QB drafting at ~20 every year, and they seem unwilling to roll the dice on a new coach, who, to be fair, could end up being less successful than Tomlin.

The biggest difference is that baseball has no salary cap. In the other two sports so long as you are reasonably good in drafting and coaching (developing) you shouldn't be out of the playoffs for too long. The Pirates have the perfect trifecta of (1) cheap ownership (2) incompetent at identifying talent, and (3) incompetent at developing talent.

The Steelers success was a product of Dan Rooney and his ability to identify the right people to run the team. Both the old man Art Sr, and the current owner Art II, while well-meaning don't seem to have the touch to produce a winner.

I think Dubas will get the Penguins turned in the right direction while it may take longer than most of us want. I think the allegiance to Sid and trying to win while at the same time re-build will take extra time.

[Fast B]

I decided to put myself through the agony of looking at the state of Pittsburgh sports teams in terms of making the playoffs and playoff wins, as far back as since the Penguins inception since that marked 2 important dates in sports history (1 formation of Penguins, 2 start of Super Bowl era). For purposes of this discussion, I'm counting a Steelers playoff victory as a "series" win to even it out with the other 2 sports where multiple games are played against the same team.

At present across the 3 Pittsburgh professional teams, the teams have gone 7 years without a playoff win from any of the 3 teams. During that span, the Penguins missed the playoffs twice, the Steelers missed the playoffs twice, and the Pirates...yeah, no playoffs all 7 years.

The last time things were this bad or worse in Pittsburgh sports was the 4 year period of 1985 to 1988, where no teams in that 4 year period even made the playoffs.

If you want to expand that, 1980 to 1990 was the decade of Pittsburgh misery. Across the 3 sports teams and those 11 seasons, there were 3 total series wins in that span. 2 by the Steelers (1984, 1989) and 1 by the Penguins (1989).

The Pirates have 1 series win in 45 F$%@#% YEARS!!! Besides the 2013 season, the last series win was the 1979 World Series champs years.

The difference between now and the 80s...the 80s, teams were just bad, small market, bad ownership, and rebuild after championships (Steelers).
Today, across all 3 teams, it seems to be more of complacency, profit taking, or the acceptance of just being mediocre.

Do you mean only the World Series here? I'm pretty sure the Pirates were famously in the NLCS from 90-92. As much as I hate to revisit that painful history, they did win multiple rounds to get there and it's the closest they've actually been to even making the World Series in my lifetime. (Not that they haven't sucked for most of the time anyway.)

The Pirates didn't win any playoff rounds in the 1990s. The NLDS only started in 1995. It was NLCS then World Series. Pirates lost to the Reds in 1990, and the Braves in 1991 and 1992. All of those occurred in the NLCS, when there were no rounds before the NLCS.

<----- Here's me revealing (a) my age, and (b) how thoroughly I did not research before responding to your post.

[FLPensFan]

I decided to put myself through the agony of looking at the state of Pittsburgh sports teams in terms of making the playoffs and playoff wins, as far back as since the Penguins inception since that marked 2 important dates in sports history (1 formation of Penguins, 2 start of Super Bowl era). For purposes of this discussion, I'm counting a Steelers playoff victory as a "series" win to even it out with the other 2 sports where multiple games are played against the same team.

At present across the 3 Pittsburgh professional teams, the teams have gone 7 years without a playoff win from any of the 3 teams. During that span, the Penguins missed the playoffs twice, the Steelers missed the playoffs twice, and the Pirates...yeah, no playoffs all 7 years.

The last time things were this bad or worse in Pittsburgh sports was the 4 year period of 1985 to 1988, where no teams in that 4 year period even made the playoffs.

If you want to expand that, 1980 to 1990 was the decade of Pittsburgh misery. Across the 3 sports teams and those 11 seasons, there were 3 total series wins in that span. 2 by the Steelers (1984, 1989) and 1 by the Penguins (1989).

The Pirates have 1 series win in 45 F$%@#% YEARS!!! Besides the 2013 season, the last series win was the 1979 World Series champs years.

The difference between now and the 80s...the 80s, teams were just bad, small market, bad ownership, and rebuild after championships (Steelers).
Today, across all 3 teams, it seems to be more of complacency, profit taking, or the acceptance of just being mediocre.

Do you mean only the World Series here? I'm pretty sure the Pirates were famously in the NLCS from 90-92. As much as I hate to revisit that painful history, they did win multiple rounds to get there and it's the closest they've actually been to even making the World Series in my lifetime. (Not that they haven't sucked for most of the time anyway.)

The Pirates didn't win any playoff rounds in the 1990s. The NLDS only started in 1995. It was NLCS then World Series. Pirates lost to the Reds in 1990, and the Braves in 1991 and 1992. All of those occurred in the NLCS, when there were no rounds before the NLCS.

<----- Here's me revealing (a) my age, and (b) how thoroughly I did not research before responding to your post.

It's ok. I was in high school those years, and I could have sworn the way the Pirates were hyped up during those playoffs that they won rounds, too.

[Daniel]

I decided to put myself through the agony of looking at the state of Pittsburgh sports teams in terms of making the playoffs and playoff wins, as far back as since the Penguins inception since that marked 2 important dates in sports history (1 formation of Penguins, 2 start of Super Bowl era). For purposes of this discussion, I'm counting a Steelers playoff victory as a "series" win to even it out with the other 2 sports where multiple games are played against the same team.

At present across the 3 Pittsburgh professional teams, the teams have gone 7 years without a playoff win from any of the 3 teams. During that span, the Penguins missed the playoffs twice, the Steelers missed the playoffs twice, and the Pirates...yeah, no playoffs all 7 years.

The last time things were this bad or worse in Pittsburgh sports was the 4 year period of 1985 to 1988, where no teams in that 4 year period even made the playoffs.

If you want to expand that, 1980 to 1990 was the decade of Pittsburgh misery. Across the 3 sports teams and those 11 seasons, there were 3 total series wins in that span. 2 by the Steelers (1984, 1989) and 1 by the Penguins (1989).

The Pirates have 1 series win in 45 F$%@#% YEARS!!! Besides the 2013 season, the last series win was the 1979 World Series champs years.

The difference between now and the 80s...the 80s, teams were just bad, small market, bad ownership, and rebuild after championships (Steelers).
Today, across all 3 teams, it seems to be more of complacency, profit taking, or the acceptance of just being mediocre.

I still think the Pens right now are more like the 80s Steelers where they're rebuilding after a 10-12 year run as serious contenders. They're not calling it a rebuild, but I think Dubas clearly shifted into that mode last trade deadline. It's probably not as deep and quick a rebuild as we fans might like, but I'm still giving Dubas some time to make things work. Already, it feels like the first time in a long time that we have honest-to-goodness prospects in the system.

The Pirates just aren't relevant until they get new ownership.

The Steelers are actually in a pretty tricky spot, I think. Tomlin is a high floor/low ceiling sort of coach, and they have some legitimately good players, making it hard to just say, "blow it all up and rebuild." But it seems like to be real contenders, they need an elite QB and/or a coaching staff that can actually out scheme the better teams in the league. It's unlikely they can get an elite QB drafting at ~20 every year, and they seem unwilling to roll the dice on a new coach, who, to be fair, could end up being less successful than Tomlin.

The only problems with the Steelers is coaching, DL, WR2

[Daniel]

I decided to put myself through the agony of looking at the state of Pittsburgh sports teams in terms of making the playoffs and playoff wins, as far back as since the Penguins inception since that marked 2 important dates in sports history (1 formation of Penguins, 2 start of Super Bowl era). For purposes of this discussion, I'm counting a Steelers playoff victory as a "series" win to even it out with the other 2 sports where multiple games are played against the same team.

At present across the 3 Pittsburgh professional teams, the teams have gone 7 years without a playoff win from any of the 3 teams. During that span, the Penguins missed the playoffs twice, the Steelers missed the playoffs twice, and the Pirates...yeah, no playoffs all 7 years.

The last time things were this bad or worse in Pittsburgh sports was the 4 year period of 1985 to 1988, where no teams in that 4 year period even made the playoffs.

If you want to expand that, 1980 to 1990 was the decade of Pittsburgh misery. Across the 3 sports teams and those 11 seasons, there were 3 total series wins in that span. 2 by the Steelers (1984, 1989) and 1 by the Penguins (1989).

The Pirates have 1 series win in 45 F$%@#% YEARS!!! Besides the 2013 season, the last series win was the 1979 World Series champs years.

The difference between now and the 80s...the 80s, teams were just bad, small market, bad ownership, and rebuild after championships (Steelers).
Today, across all 3 teams, it seems to be more of complacency, profit taking, or the acceptance of just being mediocre.

I still think the Pens right now are more like the 80s Steelers where they're rebuilding after a 10-12 year run as serious contenders. They're not calling it a rebuild, but I think Dubas clearly shifted into that mode last trade deadline. It's probably not as deep and quick a rebuild as we fans might like, but I'm still giving Dubas some time to make things work. Already, it feels like the first time in a long time that we have honest-to-goodness prospects in the system.

The Pirates just aren't relevant until they get new ownership.

The Steelers are actually in a pretty tricky spot, I think. Tomlin is a high floor/low ceiling sort of coach, and they have some legitimately good players, making it hard to just say, "blow it all up and rebuild." But it seems like to be real contenders, they need an elite QB and/or a coaching staff that can actually out scheme the better teams in the league. It's unlikely they can get an elite QB drafting at ~20 every year, and they seem unwilling to roll the dice on a new coach, who, to be fair, could end up being less successful than Tomlin.

The biggest difference is that baseball has no salary cap. In the other two sports so long as you are reasonably good in drafting and coaching (developing) you shouldn't be out of the playoffs for too long. The Pirates have the perfect trifecta of (1) cheap ownership (2) incompetent at identifying talent, and (3) incompetent at developing talent.

The Steelers success was a product of Dan Rooney and his ability to identify the right people to run the team. Both the old man Art Sr, and the current owner Art II, while well-meaning don't seem to have the touch to produce a winner.

I think Dubas will get the Penguins turned in the right direction while it may take longer than most of us want. I think the allegiance to Sid and trying to win while at the same time re-build will take extra time.

They have revenue sharing, which the Pirates steal from and keep the salary lower. I think they either need to get rid of the revenue sharing or force a minimum salary.

[Cow_Master66]

For as miserable as the Pirates are, being at the Quedo game will easily go down as my greatest sports experience. The atmosphere that night can literally never be duplicated given all the variables and how the game actually played out.

[BurghThing]

I decided to put myself through the agony of looking at the state of Pittsburgh sports teams in terms of making the playoffs and playoff wins, as far back as since the Penguins inception since that marked 2 important dates in sports history (1 formation of Penguins, 2 start of Super Bowl era). For purposes of this discussion, I'm counting a Steelers playoff victory as a "series" win to even it out with the other 2 sports where multiple games are played against the same team.

At present across the 3 Pittsburgh professional teams, the teams have gone 7 years without a playoff win from any of the 3 teams. During that span, the Penguins missed the playoffs twice, the Steelers missed the playoffs twice, and the Pirates...yeah, no playoffs all 7 years.

The last time things were this bad or worse in Pittsburgh sports was the 4 year period of 1985 to 1988, where no teams in that 4 year period even made the playoffs.

If you want to expand that, 1980 to 1990 was the decade of Pittsburgh misery. Across the 3 sports teams and those 11 seasons, there were 3 total series wins in that span. 2 by the Steelers (1984, 1989) and 1 by the Penguins (1989).

The Pirates have 1 series win in 45 F$%@#% YEARS!!! Besides the 2013 season, the last series win was the 1979 World Series champs years.

The difference between now and the 80s...the 80s, teams were just bad, small market, bad ownership, and rebuild after championships (Steelers).
Today, across all 3 teams, it seems to be more of complacency, profit taking, or the acceptance of just being mediocre.

I still think the Pens right now are more like the 80s Steelers where they're rebuilding after a 10-12 year run as serious contenders. They're not calling it a rebuild, but I think Dubas clearly shifted into that mode last trade deadline. It's probably not as deep and quick a rebuild as we fans might like, but I'm still giving Dubas some time to make things work. Already, it feels like the first time in a long time that we have honest-to-goodness prospects in the system.

The Pirates just aren't relevant until they get new ownership.

The Steelers are actually in a pretty tricky spot, I think. Tomlin is a high floor/low ceiling sort of coach, and they have some legitimately good players, making it hard to just say, "blow it all up and rebuild." But it seems like to be real contenders, they need an elite QB and/or a coaching staff that can actually out scheme the better teams in the league. It's unlikely they can get an elite QB drafting at ~20 every year, and they seem unwilling to roll the dice on a new coach, who, to be fair, could end up being less successful than Tomlin.

The only problems with the Steelers is coaching, DL, WR2

OL

[Daniel]

I decided to put myself through the agony of looking at the state of Pittsburgh sports teams in terms of making the playoffs and playoff wins, as far back as since the Penguins inception since that marked 2 important dates in sports history (1 formation of Penguins, 2 start of Super Bowl era). For purposes of this discussion, I'm counting a Steelers playoff victory as a "series" win to even it out with the other 2 sports where multiple games are played against the same team.

At present across the 3 Pittsburgh professional teams, the teams have gone 7 years without a playoff win from any of the 3 teams. During that span, the Penguins missed the playoffs twice, the Steelers missed the playoffs twice, and the Pirates...yeah, no playoffs all 7 years.

The last time things were this bad or worse in Pittsburgh sports was the 4 year period of 1985 to 1988, where no teams in that 4 year period even made the playoffs.

If you want to expand that, 1980 to 1990 was the decade of Pittsburgh misery. Across the 3 sports teams and those 11 seasons, there were 3 total series wins in that span. 2 by the Steelers (1984, 1989) and 1 by the Penguins (1989).

The Pirates have 1 series win in 45 F$%@#% YEARS!!! Besides the 2013 season, the last series win was the 1979 World Series champs years.

The difference between now and the 80s...the 80s, teams were just bad, small market, bad ownership, and rebuild after championships (Steelers).
Today, across all 3 teams, it seems to be more of complacency, profit taking, or the acceptance of just being mediocre.

I still think the Pens right now are more like the 80s Steelers where they're rebuilding after a 10-12 year run as serious contenders. They're not calling it a rebuild, but I think Dubas clearly shifted into that mode last trade deadline. It's probably not as deep and quick a rebuild as we fans might like, but I'm still giving Dubas some time to make things work. Already, it feels like the first time in a long time that we have honest-to-goodness prospects in the system.

The Pirates just aren't relevant until they get new ownership.

The Steelers are actually in a pretty tricky spot, I think. Tomlin is a high floor/low ceiling sort of coach, and they have some legitimately good players, making it hard to just say, "blow it all up and rebuild." But it seems like to be real contenders, they need an elite QB and/or a coaching staff that can actually out scheme the better teams in the league. It's unlikely they can get an elite QB drafting at ~20 every year, and they seem unwilling to roll the dice on a new coach, who, to be fair, could end up being less successful than Tomlin.

The only problems with the Steelers is coaching, DL, WR2

OL

I don't think the players on the OL are the problem, though Seumalo needs to be replace since he's a UFA after next season. Frazier will be a stud, McCormick will be at least serviceable and probably pretty good. Fautanu & Jones will be good tackles. The problem is they need a good OL coach to develop these players. It's a young line so we will see growing pains but there is talent there.