LGP Parenting Thread

[Crankshaft]

Why does Nick Jr have a show about pigs that look phallic in nature?

[canaan]

Better than disneys reinforcement of bad habits in Nina needs to go.

[Factorial]

Just don't let them watch He-Man:

[shafnutz05]

Our daughter is now at that age (1 yearish) where she is starting to become self-aware. In the sense that...she tried to pull my glasses off my face.. "No Keiryn". Tries again.... "NO KEIRYN". Makes a quick angry face....then goes full double-fisted karate chops onto Dad's face. "NO!!! Go sit on the floor!" Set her on the floor...

She immediately begins "crying". Why this amuses me is the absence of tears...it's clear manipulation. She notices no one is paying her attention. She walks to the middle of the room, flops down, and starts again, occasionally pausing to look around to see if anyone is looking. It's equal parts hilarious and scary. I have to hide my face so she doesn't see me cracking up.

[shmenguin]

I thought it was hilarious for a while. I couldn't do any discipline with a straight face. I think the idea of me being in charge, combined with the absurdity of whatever she was doing was too much to handle.

[count2infinity]

[Kraftster]

Our daughter is now at that age (1 yearish) where she is starting to become self-aware. In the sense that...she tried to pull my glasses off my face.. "No Keiryn". Tries again.... "NO KEIRYN". Makes a quick angry face....then goes full double-fisted karate chops onto Dad's face. "NO!!! Go sit on the floor!" Set her on the floor...

She immediately begins "crying". Why this amuses me is the absence of tears...it's clear manipulation. She notices no one is paying her attention. She walks to the middle of the room, flops down, and starts again, occasionally pausing to look around to see if anyone is looking. It's equal parts hilarious and scary. I have to hide my face so she doesn't see me cracking up.

I'm sure it was probably just a casual word choice of yours, but I get on a soap box when people around me or those I know talk about really young children being "manipulative" and mean it in a pejorative way. Children experimenting with how they can and cannot impact things around them is a very important part of developing a properly balanced locus of control. Attributing calculating manipulation to young children can lead to bad parenting, I think. Take the "throw something on the floor from my high chair" trick. I've heard people speak angrily about kids starting to "manipulate" at a young age when they see parents continue to indulge this trick and pick up whatever is thrown on the floor. Really, this is much more likely the beginnings of comprehension and understanding of object permanence, another important part of development. Okay, end rant. And again, not speaking to you shad.

[eddysnake]

I'm watching the game and the kids are running around playing, I ask what they are playing. Their answer... Genghis kahn. I casually go back to watching the game and 10 minutes later realize what they said. What the hell?

[canaan]

At least they didn't say caligula

[PensFanInDC]

Lol

[eddysnake]

They know we play that with the entire family

[PensFanInDC]

Lol

[PensFanInDC]

Our daughter is now at that age (1 yearish) where she is starting to become self-aware. In the sense that...she tried to pull my glasses off my face.. "No Keiryn". Tries again.... "NO KEIRYN". Makes a quick angry face....then goes full double-fisted karate chops onto Dad's face. "NO!!! Go sit on the floor!" Set her on the floor...

She immediately begins "crying". Why this amuses me is the absence of tears...it's clear manipulation. She notices no one is paying her attention. She walks to the middle of the room, flops down, and starts again, occasionally pausing to look around to see if anyone is looking. It's equal parts hilarious and scary. I have to hide my face so she doesn't see me cracking up.

I'm sure it was probably just a casual word choice of yours, but I get on a soap box when people around me or those I know talk about really young children being "manipulative" and mean it in a pejorative way. Children experimenting with how they can and cannot impact things around them is a very important part of developing a properly balanced locus of control. Attributing calculating manipulation to young children can lead to bad parenting, I think. Take the "throw something on the floor from my high chair" trick. I've heard people speak angrily about kids starting to "manipulate" at a young age when they see parents continue to indulge this trick and pick up whatever is thrown on the floor. Really, this is much more likely the beginnings of comprehension and understanding of object permanence, another important part of development. Okay, end rant. And again, not speaking to you shad.

If you are not a parent Kraftster you are already on your way to being a good one. Excellent observation and I totally agree that this has nothing to do with Shad or how he handled the situation. I think Shad did a fantastic job. I've been there before.

Children certainly do go through a time when they are "manipulative". As you said, maybe it was just casual word choice. It's more like testing boundaries to see what they can do or "get away with". There also comes a time when they try and assert some dominance over the parents because, for their short 2 or 3 year life, they have been dominated by these parents and they want to try. It's up to the parents to stay strong and don't give in IMO.

"throw something on the floor from my high chair" trick

This actually has 2 meanings. The first is the development of depth perception. When a child less than a year old (sometimes older) does this the odds are that he/she is just learning about depth perception and there is no malicious intent behind it. When the child is older and does it just to see his parents pick it up for him is when it becomes an issue. It can sometimes take a week or so to really understand that is what the child is doing. For us a simple "Well you put it on the floor so that is where it stays" seemed to work. He's more careful about what leaves the table now.

Shad mentioned having to hide his laughing from his daughter. I think that is probably the hardest part about early discipline. Maybe it's because he/she is your child, but the first signs of defiance are really cute. Seriously. If there are 2 parents present it makes it easier because one can turn and hide the laughter while the other takes care of business. There have been countless occasions where my son did something defiant that was hysterical and it was all I could do to not laugh. Sometimes you can hide it, sometimes you can't. Laughing at defiance a couple of times isn't going to make the child into a little bastard. One time when we were out at a restaurant the boy was a little rambunctious. He wasn't crazy and I'm willing to bet he wasn't bothering anyone else in the place but I didn't want it to get there. He was standing next to his mother and wouldn't sit down. I asked him to come sit next to me. Nothing. I TOLD him to come sit next to me. Nothing. I started counting, something I almost never do because I never saw the point really. When I got to 3 he was still standing there and I told him "You wont like what happens when I say 5." That was a mistake. He marched right over to me, looked me dead in the eye, and said "Say five!". I didn't know whether to laugh, beat the crap out of him, or cry. I picked him up and marched him right outside not having a clue as to what I was going to do. I put him in the car and into his car seat. I still had no idea. I closed the door. Then I realized that he won. I wasn't prepared for that. Hopefully I am next time.

*warning. opinion alert* Discipline is personal. Each family has to decide what they are going to do. IMO it's extremely important for the parents to be on the same page so that there isn't any contradiction of each other in front of the child and any form of discipline is handed down immediately and without delay. We choose not to hit. I do, however, raise my voice (not screaming. authoritative) when the boy crosses the line. A stern and loud "WOAH!" is all he needs now to stop whatever the hell he is doing and stare at me. That's another thing. TALK TO YOUR KIDS! Even at 18 months talk to them like a normal person. Kneel or squat down to their level and make them look you in the eye while you talk to them. Don't go on and on for 60 seconds about what they did wrong. The attention span isn't there yet. Make them look you in the eye, explain what they did wrong, ask them if they understand what they did wrong, and move on. If it becomes an issue, discipline as you have deemed fit. When the boy crosses that line and say "WOAH!" he stops and looks me right in the eye because he knows a talking to is coming. He responds well to that. Some kids might not.

[shmenguin]

Counting to 3 works for us almost every time. If we get to 3, she goes to timeout. Very effective.

It's helpful that she's extremely verbal. She has understood our words since well before she was 2. When they can talk instead of grunt and scream, it's better for everyone.

[PensFanInDC]

The first 2 or 3 times I tried counting it worked on him. He knew something was up and acted immediately. After that he waited to see what happened at 3. Well it was time out. Problem is the little bastard likes timeout so we changed the location and instead of sitting he was standing. That didn't work either. We have found that "You can do it on your own or we can make you do it" has worked. When we say it he responds and does it on his own. I guess that's the same thing except with different words.

Totally agree on ability to communicate. My son has always been very verbal and can articulate what he wants very well and has been since before he was 2 as well. He has trouble with the difference between 'want' and 'need' but that will come.

[Pavel Bure]

I'm finding many of the things I use in the classroom are super helpful with even a 7 month old. Children need consistency and routine when they are young. The days that my son is broken from his routine of naps means that, that evening he will be super cranky and hard to get to sleep.

The biggest thing I see though from kids in the schools and mainly from my niece and nephew are that empty threats are terrible. The whole put that down or you're going in timeout and then when they disobey timeout isn't given is only teaching my niece mainly that she doesn't have to listen and can purposely not follow the rules she is given. She only does this stuff with her parents because they make empty threats. She doesn't do that with her grand parents or with my wife and I because we will put her in timeout without questions.

[shmenguin]

I'll echo all that. My wife teaches 1st grade. Her experience there has been such a huge help.

[PensFanInDC]

I'll third it. An empty threat is one of the worst things you can do. If you say "Stop this and that or I'll turn this car around and we'll go home!" you better be prepared to do just that.

[eddysnake]

empty threats have been the hardest thing for me. I'm really good at them. I've been trying to make them more complex and terrifying (build a rocket ship and shoot them to a planet full of alien snakes and bears) on my personal quest to rid them totally from my daily life.

Had parent-teacher conferences yesterday. When things go well, it's always a great feeling hearing from someone like a teacher that you are doing something right.

[Kraftster]

#2 finally arrived--five days past due date. Girl number two. Healthy and happy.
Pretty awesome seeing three year old with baby sister.

[cheesesteakwithegg]

Congrats Krafster! Are either of them making a million trades in their fantasy leagues yet?

[shafnutz05]

Congrats man :)

[shmenguin]

Congrats and good luck

[eddysnake]

Congratulations Kraftster and family, that's awesome!

[meow]

Woo-hoo!!