ISIS Crisis

[MalkinIsMyHomeboy]

They need to be stopped however possible.

orly?

Do you want to edit that or are you going to stick to it?

I don't see why it matters. I don't think Obama goes to LGP.com for advice on international affairs.

[DelPen]

When Obama takes a page out of the W playbook its going to be sickening watching Republicans go nuts and Democrats blindly agree even though they were both 180 degrees 10 years ago.

Hoping to hear a good plan tomorrow and see our President succeed in this.

[Tico Rick]

I'd rather be listening to Dylan than Obama:

[youtube][/youtube]

[tifosi77]

When Obama takes a page out of the W playbook its going to be sickening watching Republicans go nuts and Democrats blindly agree even though they were both 180 degrees 10 years ago.

There are some marked differences this time, tho. ISIS/ISIL is a genuine regional threat with territorial aspirations that include parts of Europe. They have also publicly stated a desire to bring violence to the United States' shores. Those two facts alone make ISIS/ISIL stand in sharp relief to the situation in Iraq in 2002/3, so I wouldn't necessarily see support for a military intervention today if you were opposed to it in 2003 as a switcheroo. I mean, that's the boat I'm finding myself in more and more with these maniacs.

[columbia]

So what's the end game here? Wipe out Isis and let Syria go back to its civil war?

[Factorial]

When Obama takes a page out of the W playbook its going to be sickening watching Republicans go nuts and Democrats blindly agree even though they were both 180 degrees 10 years ago.

There are some marked differences this time, tho. ISIS/ISIL is a genuine regional threat with territorial aspirations that include parts of Europe. They have also publicly stated a desire to bring violence to the United States' shores. Those two facts alone make ISIS/ISIL stand in sharp relief to the situation in Iraq in 2002/3, so I wouldn't necessarily see support for a military intervention today if you were opposed to it in 2003 as a switcheroo. I mean, that's the boat I'm finding myself in more and more with these maniacs.

You beat me to it so I'll just echo your response. Situation is totally different.

[Tico Rick]

So what's the end game here? Wipe out Isis and let Syria go back to its civil war?

Get rid of Isis AND Assad and pray to Allah that some moderate group will emerge to take over.

[PensFanInDC]

So what's the end game here? Wipe out Isis and let Syria go back to its civil war?

Get rid of Isis AND Assad and pray to Allah that some moderate group will emerge to take over.

[youtube][/youtube]

[DelPen]

When Obama takes a page out of the W playbook its going to be sickening watching Republicans go nuts and Democrats blindly agree even though they were both 180 degrees 10 years ago.

There are some marked differences this time, tho. ISIS/ISIL is a genuine regional threat with territorial aspirations that include parts of Europe. They have also publicly stated a desire to bring violence to the United States' shores. Those two facts alone make ISIS/ISIL stand in sharp relief to the situation in Iraq in 2002/3, so I wouldn't necessarily see support for a military intervention today if you were opposed to it in 2003 as a switcheroo. I mean, that's the boat I'm finding myself in more and more with these maniacs.

You beat me to it so I'll just echo your response. Situation is totally different.

More referring to politicians when one party does something the other side just has to be against it but when the other party does the exact same thing they reverse roles.

[Tico Rick]

I tend to agree, PensFanInDC - not gonna happen. Actually, I think Obama is banking a lot on the new Iraqi PM being more inclusive with the Sunnis, hoping to bring them back into the fold in the hope that a more united Iraq will then be able to quell ISIS inside of Iraq. Then he'll figure out what to do with ISIS in Syria later. Plan B is probably to let the Kurds go their own way and establish their own state - which would be a last ditch move considering that Turkey would probably be opposed to this.

[Troy Loney]

When Obama takes a page out of the W playbook its going to be sickening watching Republicans go nuts and Democrats blindly agree even though they were both 180 degrees 10 years ago.

There are some marked differences this time, tho. ISIS/ISIL is a genuine regional threat with territorial aspirations that include parts of Europe. They have also publicly stated a desire to bring violence to the United States' shores. Those two facts alone make ISIS/ISIL stand in sharp relief to the situation in Iraq in 2002/3, so I wouldn't necessarily see support for a military intervention today if you were opposed to it in 2003 as a switcheroo. I mean, that's the boat I'm finding myself in more and more with these maniacs.

Plus it seems if Obama is going to use anyone's playbook, it'd probably be Bush Senior. I think he'll look for a global coalition to combat ISIS. Not unilateral US action.

[Factorial]

I tend to agree, PensFanInDC - not gonna happen. Actually, I think Obama is banking a lot on the new Iraqi PM being more inclusive with the Sunnis, hoping to bring them back into the fold in the hope that a more united Iraq will then be able to quell ISIS inside of Iraq. Then he'll figure out what to do with ISIS in Syria later. Plan B is probably to let the Kurds go their own way and establish their own state - which would be a last ditch move considering that Turkey would probably be opposed to this.

I worked with a Turk and he was VERY dismissive of the Kurds. These other Sunni countries need to get involved or ISIS will be coming for them next.

[Trip McNeely]

I tend to agree, PensFanInDC - not gonna happen. Actually, I think Obama is banking a lot on the new Iraqi PM being more inclusive with the Sunnis, hoping to bring them back into the fold in the hope that a more united Iraq will then be able to quell ISIS inside of Iraq. Then he'll figure out what to do with ISIS in Syria later. Plan B is probably to let the Kurds go their own way and establish their own state - which would be a last ditch move considering that Turkey would probably be opposed to this.

I worked with a Turk and he was VERY dismissive of the Kurds. These other Sunni countries need to get involved or ISIS will be coming for them next.

The Turks are enemies with the Kurds in general because of the PKK. The PKK (Kurdistan workers party) is basically a seperatist group that is trying to create their own state in I believe the western part of Turkey. They are also considered a terrorist group by the US. They are regarding much differently than the Kurds in Iraq (at least by the US).

The entire issue with this entire region is the complication of enemies and friends. They all overlap and are intertwined. It makes it impossible to really have true allies because being an ally with one state or group causes another ally to become enraged.

[Gaucho]

Not to defend the PKK, but they're hardly the cause for the Turkish-Kurdisch conflict.

[Tico Rick]

There are 30-40 million Kurds, which is about 5 times the population of Israel. They all live in the same area and they have a unified culture, yet they do not have their own state. Another screw up by the colonial powers when drawing border lines in the Middle East.

http://www.worldsecuritynetwork.com/Rel ... -countries

[Tico Rick]

I worked with a Turk and he was VERY dismissive of the Kurds.

That's pretty much to be expected from a Turk, isn't it?

[tifosi77]

A couple of good (if badly edited) pieces at The Diplomat about the origin of ISIS/ISIL

Iran Didn’t Create ISIS; We Did

How the US Made ISIS a Threat

[PensFanInDC]

A big old whopping case of who cares. Just clean it up.

[PensFanInDC]

Also, the west didn't invent radical Islam. We just helped fund, train, and arm it.

[shafnutz05]

Exactly. Radical Islam has been around for like 1,382 years. Or something

[eddysnake]

ISIS has won the coin toss, and they have elected to receive. Bombs away. Merica.

[ulf]

ISIS has won the coin toss, and they have elected to receive. Bombs away. Merica.

lol

Honestly, this is one thing I wish we would get involved in. But after Iraq and Afghanistan, it just seems like it would end up being a mistake. If those two occurrences never happened, I'd be all for intervention. This is the most legitimate threat yet.

[Southern Fan]

So over the next 90 days, we will see

1) ISIS/ISIL placing black flags on hospitals and schools and we will be the bad guys bombing children

2) ISIS will cross the imaginary line between Turkey and Syria and we won't be able to bomb them. We'll see how much Turkey is in the coalition.

3) The troops we "train" will turn against us and the equipment will end up in the enemies hands.

4) Assad will appeal to Putin for help and the UN and China will back Putin.

5) Our secret friends, the Iranians, will be more emboldened to upgrade their nuclear program in exchange for silence.

What are mess. I just don't see Obama dealing with these things after the mid term elections.

[Gaucho]

Corn.

[shafnutz05]

Another person beheaded today by ISIS.

The United States, and the West in general, has made many mistakes in that region of the world, no doubt about it. And we have most certainly gotten our hands dirty in places we have no business being.

All that being said, I think it is a cheap cop-out to simply chalk up the actions of these savages as reactions to "imperialist foreign policy". Saudi Arabia doesn't impose horrific penalties and restrictions on women because of United States foreign policy. Women aren't stoned for being raped because of USFP. Children aren't used as suicide bombers because of USFP.

I could go on and on, but I'm tired of hearing about how everything that's bad that happens over there is somehow our fault. We've screwed up a lot of things, but religious extremism cannot completely be blamed on what we've done in the region. I truly hope for the Islamic world, but I don't see a change coming anytime soon. Hell, the much-celebrated "Arab Spring" merely overturned secular dictators and replaced them with theocratic regimes.